Bad Rectifier? That's what I thought... By jstluise (Read 9,602 times)

[tvnacman]

You should never have ac on the red wire off the regulator. With somemore thought to this you could have dc shorting with ac . Check with an ohm meter from the red to the white and to yellow (regulator unpluged). Should read very high restance if any reading at all.

John

[jstluise]

May 11, 2012 9:07:32 GMT -6 tvnacman said:

The diodes in the regulator maybe shorted as a result of the bad flasher. You need to keep the bad flasher out of the system and you need a good battery connected. Then check the system again. The battery acts as a filter/capacitor to smooth the ripple .

I have a new battery. I'll connect it and re test. So are you never suppose to run without a battery in?

You should never have accord (AC?) on the red wire off the regulator. With somemore thought to this you could have dc. shorting with ac . Check with an ohm meter from the red to the white and to yellow. Should read very high restance if any reading at all.

I have measured the resistances between all pins on the R/R, and they all show open (infinite).

I'm never suppose to have AC voltage on the charging wire (red), so it has to be the regulator, right? Hmmm...

[Bashan]

• Don't worry about the AC reading on your multi while checking the battery charging. On AC it's looking for half of the AC waveform but is seeing the linear function of DC so it doubles it.
  
• Two R/Rs can't be bad, it's got to be something else.
  
• I don't think it's the stator now either after looking at your wiring diagram.
  
• The diode drop doesn't matter, the significant part is if it passes voltage one way but blocks it the other.
  
• These R/Rs have many components in series, it's hard to "find" the diodes in there hence the dark readings.
  
• Interesting on the bad flasher relay, live and learn.
  
• Try the following test, hook your multi up as in the diagram and tell us the milliamps you get with the key off:
  

[sprocket]

Rich you are the best bullet list guy I know!

Sure you can run it without the battery in the scooter you may have a short in the battery which is causing the problem ...disconnect the red wire and give it a try.

This has been dictated from an iPad.. gotta love this...

[tvnacman]

May 11, 2012 9:14:10 GMT -6 tvnacman said:

You should never have ac on the red wire off the regulator. With somemore thought to this you could have dc shorting with ac . Check with an ohm meter from the red to the white and to yellow (regulator unpluged). Should read very high restance if any reading at all.

John

I made corrections to this post (dam android)

the scooter will run without the battery , the output dcv will be with less ripple if any with the battery .

If your getting no continuity between the red and yellow , red to white with the regulator unpluged and your getting ac on the dc side , then your regulator rectifier is passing acv . I went through this with my scooter . I up graded to 11pole 7pin , the cheaper and easer way would have been to replace the 4pin regulator that was blown . With a new 4pin regulator (that caused overcharging) and installed a balast resistor . How ever I did not listen to others here .

Rich , look at his picture its got the FLP !!!!!

Sprocket , I remember you have told me that 07 and older they used balast resistors , then in 08 they stopped . It had to be they made changes to the regulator . the stock regulator (stamped FLP)is a later 08 version of the 4pin regulator from the factory . The replacement 4pin is an 07 production or older when balast resistors were stock items on the scooters . So the replacement regulator needs the ballast resistor .

Here is a resistance chart I made of a good FLP regulator . In order to get the readings I got you must use a meter that will read high resistance . If your meter will not read at least 100M ohms you will not be able to read the regulator .

i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/tvnacman/IMAG0167.jpg

I have an older version of the 4pin regulator and a balast resistor .

John

[jstluise]

Thank you everyone for the help! This forum is awesome!

I am leaving for vacation and will be gone for a week...I will try all of your recommendations when I return and post with some updates. Hopefully we'll get this figured out soon.

Thanks again!

[tvnacman]

enjoy your vacation !!!!!!!!!!!

John

[jstluise]

May 11, 2012 20:07:24 GMT -6 tvnacman said:

Here is a resistance chart I made of a good FLP regulator . In order to get the readings I got you must use a meter that will read high resistance . If your meter will not read at least 100M ohms you will not be able to read the regulator .

i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/tvnacman/IMAG0167.jpg

I have an older version of the 4pin regulator and a balast resistor .

John

I have access to a better DMM at work, so I took some measurements of the original and replacement R/R I got. I believe I got the correct orientation of the pins.

i.imgur.com/BPlcw.jpg

They look comparable (I guess, in the relative sense). Not sure how to interpret the measurements.

Can you explain the ballast resistor?

[jstluise]

May 11, 2012 9:32:55 GMT -6 Bashan said:

• Try the following test, hook your multi up as in the diagram and tell us the milliamps you get with the key off:
  

Okay, I am determined to get this problem figured out. Been pretty busy so haven't had a chance to troubleshoot.

I performed the suggested test. With the key off, I get zero current (open circuit). I believe this is good.

I hooked everything up again (w/ battery and replacement R/R). I got 16.2-16.8 VDC at the battery (red wire) and 11.8-12.2 VAC (yellow wire) at varying RPMS.

Its been a while since I've worked on this, but it seems like that is okay, even thought he DC voltage is a little high...at least it is regulated.

Not sure what else there is to test...

[Alleyoop]

Well if the Regulator/Rectifier is putting out over 15VDC it is BAD it will FRY your battery. Should be under 15Vdc usually a good one will put out around 14.5 or in the 13s.
Alleyoop

[jstluise]

May 30, 2012 23:43:23 GMT -6 Alleyoop said:

Well if the Regulator/Rectifier is putting out over 15VDC it is BAD it will FRY your battery. Should be under 15Vdc usually a good one will put out around 14.5 or in the 13s.
Alleyoop

Right. This is bad. But, the good part is that it is regulated...just high. Everything else looks good, too (ie the AC voltage).

So, I just need to get that regulated voltage down. I will be on the two other R/Rs I have and see what they put out.

[Alleyoop]

Yep, everything else looks good, many times people get bad R/Rs which is a shame, but that is CHINO quality(NOT).
Alleyoop

[tvnacman]

May 23, 2012 9:31:45 GMT -6 jstluise said:

May 11, 2012 20:07:24 GMT -6 tvnacman said:

Here is a resistance chart I made of a good FLP regulator . In order to get the readings I got you must use a meter that will read high resistance . If your meter will not read at least 100M ohms you will not be able to read the regulator .

i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc483/tvnacman/IMAG0167.jpg

I have an older version of the 4pin regulator and a balast resistor .

John

I have access to a better DMM at work, so I took some measurements of the original and replacement R/R I got. I believe I got the correct orientation of the pins.

i.imgur.com/BPlcw.jpg

They look comparable (I guess, in the relative sense). Not sure how to interpret the measurements.

Can you explain the ballast resistor?

The ballast resistor is just extra load it will pull the charging voltage down . when I was going through what your going through . I gave up and changed out to 11pole stator and 7pin regulator .

Its clear to me you see electric , have you seen the diagram of the seven pin regulator . The black wire is feed back and senses system voltage and auto adjusts voltage output .

If you would like to try the ballast resistor , the cheapest route I have them . I also have the 11pole and seven set up .

How was vacation ?

John

[jstluise]

Jun 1, 2012 21:52:32 GMT -6 tvnacman said:

The ballast resistor is just extra load it will pull the charging voltage down . when I was going through what your going through . I gave up and changed out to 11pole stator and 7pin regulator .

Its clear to me you see electric , have you seen the diagram of the seven pin regulator . The black wire is feed back and senses system voltage and auto adjusts voltage output .

If you would like to try the ballast resistor , the cheapest route I have them . I also have the 11pole and seven set up .

How was vacation ?

John

That's what I thought the ballast resistor would do. Sounds like that would be the cheapest route, but it feels kind of like a band aid to me. Are there different sizes of resistors, which depend on how much you need to pull the voltage down?

The 11 pole setup has appealed to me since I bought the scooter; I shouldn't have a problem powering all the stock lights + my 35W auxiliary light (right?).

Can you send me some info on the 11 + 7 setup? From what I understand, the components to buy are the R/R, stator, and flywheel? I'll look around for a write-up about it.

Vacation was great! Can't beat Hawaii when I'm dealing with this Seattle weather all the time

[tvnacman]

I know in here somewhere there is/was a complete thread with blow by blow instructions . I don't know how to find them .

thescooterprofessor.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=specials&action=display&thread=800

I would like to see you try the ballast resistor , I have them and the 11pole 7pin set up .

John