To get a 50cc to get 45-50mph takes a lot of mods and a very good tuner to also tune the CVT. I would not believe every dude that says his modded 50 does 45-50mph. There is only one dude that I know of that can build a 50cc to do high numbers on mph and that dude is MILLSC. So do not go by what some say they are getting in top end speed. Most count going downhill hunched over like a little kid over the handlebars their top end speed. I get in trouble because I call some of them out to prove it and they never do.
The motor has to have enough power to pull the weight so if you do not add more horses to the motor you can only get it to go so fast. Now most 50s that can get to high rpms NEED ABOUT a mile run to make those numbers(which is useless in my book).
You want something to take off from a stop light and keep ahead of the traffic and not hold traffic up as well as something to be able to go at least 10mph over the posted speed limit. As anyone knows if the speed limit says 45 the traffic is doing 55, 35 the traffic is doing 45 etc..
So in the city a scoot that can do a real 55mph is good but not good for the freeways. With some mods on a 150 you can get it to do a real 60mph which is more than enough for city or burbs streets. Alleyoop
You must of read I run with a KOSO . All I can tell you is I like the KOSO it produces good low end and good top end for my Trike. I have tried some expensive Variators like the PRODIGY and DR2 I also have tried the KS which is like the PRODIGY. And out of all of them I like the KOSO which is very cheap compared to other performance variators. The DR2 I paid over $100.00 dollars I even wrote up a thread about it. I sold the DR2 to someone on this forum for half the price and threw in a brand new 24mm carb and a bunch of weights of different grams felt sorry for the dude.
There are some that do not like the KOSO and actually blame it for problems that they actually created themselves. But hey if that is what they want to tell people so be it. Alleyoop
I installed the Koso variator today and have to say BIG difference! Comparison picture:
The Koso very much lowered my RPMs, I couldn't believe it. It feels like it's much more "gripped" onto the gear and not so "revvy." It also does something strange that I didn't expect at all... it takes off soon as I touch the throttle now!? It doesn't bother to rev up to 4k first; it just takes off from idle RPMs soon as I give any gas. Is that normal? Idling at 1500-1900 depending on temp outside.
Video: First start and rev after putting it in. I revved it up slowly up to about 5k or so. I noticed the belt isn't riding all the way up the variator..??
Here's what my "MPH @ RPMs" are now. 23mph cruise - 3500rpm 30mph cruise - 4000rpm 40mph cruise - 5000rpm 50mph cruise - 6000rpm 58mph full throttle - 6900rpm 58mph DEcelerating - 6200mph Medium acceleration from a stop - 5000rpm Heavy acceleration from a stop - 5500rpm
I so far wasn't able to get it past 58mph on the speedometer on my first test ride. Old variator record is 62mph indicated. I'll try it more later on. I was going against the wind.
I know my bike always has like some sort of readjustment thing that lasts a few days after the variator gets touched, so maybe it'll completely change how it acts after a few rides. Like, after I put in my new rollers a few weeks ago, it had a constant RPM, then after a few days it started having that "shift" in RPM shortly after taking off, and stayed that way.
Last Edit: Dec 8, 2015 22:35:06 GMT -6 by rosiemoto
Great!! Notice how high the belt climbed on the KOSO. On the OEM it climbed about 1/8-1/4 away from the edge and that Variator is 4 inches across the KOSO is 4 1/2 inchs across and the belt climbed looks like 1/4 from the edge so the belt did climb higher on the KOSO.
From your heavy acceleration from a stop only getting to 5500 rpms by your tach that tells me the weights are a little on the heavy side. You may want to try .5 or 1 full gram lighter weights to get your rpms just a little higher that is of course if you want. Reason it is not REVVY as you put it and why it starts to move with only a little throttle is due to the weights being a little to heavy for that Variator and causing the belt to climb up the variator with low rpms. I must say getting 58mph against the wind is DAMN good for a stock 150 motor is this GPS or what the SPEEDO is registering? Alleyoop
From your heavy acceleration from a stop only getting to 5500 rpms by your tach that tells me the weights are a little on the heavy side.
Today I noticed it was under little under 5k when I gave it full throttle for a few seconds. You know, today when I was riding 10-15mph through a parking lot, I said to myself it sounds awfully like a lawnmower!
It's kinda cool in a couple ways, like some reason I'm relating it to feeling like a dirtbike/supermoto now. I guess it's from the feeling of it being gripped in gear and very little variating, and the low revving engine note makes it seem like a torque monster. But yeah it's giving me the impression it will hate me if I was to give it sudden full throttle from a stop because of such low RPM.
I did a rolling 10-40mph acceleration test and got about 1-1.5secs slower than I normally get. I can feel it's not pulling quite as hard, but it absolutely loves cruising at 45mph (indicated) at 5k RPM! It's only needing very little throttle to cruise it which feels nice; maybe an effect of being at lower RPM? And then add that my musician's ear is causing me to go over the speed limit now because I'm expecting to hear a higher pitch, so when I look down at my speedometer, OOPS I'm going 10+ over! I was wondering why everyone else was driving so slow...
I must say getting 58mph against the wind is DAMN good for a stock 150 motor is this GPS or what the SPEEDO is registering?
It's what the speedo said, so probably more like 53mph. I'm gonna take it on a 50mph road soon to see what it can do in both directions.
You may want to try .5 or 1 full gram lighter weights to get your rpms just a little higher that is of course if you want.
I've got the type of personality that likes to tweak things over and over until I like it, and ending up learning a bit in the process even if I end up right back where I started! Can I mix in my old 13g rollers if needed? (They have slight flat spots on some of them.)
I personally do not like to mix weights and they do not work like you would hope. Just think about it for a minute lets say you have 3-15 gram weights and 3-13 gram weights. Now what is going to happen is the 15 gram weights will start to move up the ramp at a certain rpm while the 13 gram weights lag behind. They will start to rattle because the 15s moved the variator out further and now there is play on the weights that are lagging behind. Also it will take more rpms to get to speed and the 13 gram weights will finally be at the same level in their ramps as the 15gram weights.
I have done extensive experimenting with my CVT. I have weights all the way from 10 gram to 13 gram and .5s(10.5,11.5,12.5 etc) in Rollers and Sliders, I have also cut down the BOSS to squeeze the belt more I have tried different rated contra springs and clutch pad springs, I have bought different variators even tried a longer belt. After all this I can tell you the 150s run and perform the best with 11, 11.5, 12, 12.5 gram weights and the weakest springs which would be your OEM, they are rated 700-800. Which grams, depends on the power the motor is producing as well as your likes.
If you are one that likes jack rabbit starts and cruise around with the motor screaming due to requiring high rpms to keep the clutch pads engaged or live in a hilly area where at every turn you are going uphill and down then I could see changing springs to produce more rpms at lower mph otherwise you will be just about walking the scoot up the hills. my .02 Alleyoop
Okay so when I feel like playing with it (maybe after a few gas fillups to see if my gas mileage is affected) I'll just put in my old set of 13g rollers and see how that goes. I'm just so surprised how extreme the difference is after I put in the Koso variator, on the same set of rollers. Is it that bigger variators need lighter rollers?
You can only get so much out of JUST YOUR CVT before needing to go to taller gearing and or more displacement to have the motor produce more ponies. You are using 15gram weights which on a 150 are way to heavy, they will lower your rpms to much which in turn will lower your top end as well as be sluggish getting up to speed.
It takes a certain amount of rpms to have the belt climb as high as possible in the Variator. Right now with the 15 gram weights MARK your variator with a marker 1/2 inch wide and 1/2 inch down from the edge AND RUN IT AT Wide open throttle and see how much of the MARK is left around the edge and measure it so you know.
Now slap in the 13gram weights and again MARK the variator and repeat the test and see what the difference is. Alleyoop
Okay I gave in and put in the 13g rollers after realizing today I wasn't able to beat traffic on takeoff anymore. My first impression after putting in the 13g rollers was "it feels sane now." (...referring to the revs not being "lawnmower-like" and bogging the engine at takeoff.). I guess I had my craving for low RPM satisfied... it was great for slow side streets and fuel economy I bet, but really not for the 35-45mph roads I frequently travel on. Here's my results and thoughts:
TOP SPEED COMPARISONS: - Old variator + 13g: 58mph against the wind, 62mph with the wind - Old variator + 15g: same as above ^ - Koso variator + 13g: 58mph against the wind, 61mph with the wind. - Koso variator + 15g: same as above ^
RPMS: - Old variator + 13g: too revvy for me, always between 5k-6k RPM at low speeds; no "shift"; 6100rpm full throttle - Old variator + 15g: much more managed cruising revs below 40mph; had a "shift." still 6100rpm full throttle - Koso variator + 13g: 4200-4500rpm on side streets (I like that). 5400rpm full throttle - Koso variator + 15g: 3500-4000rpm on side streets, boggy takeoff, 4800rpm full throttle
FULL THROTTLE ACCELERATION: Old variator + 13g: Quick takeoff. 0-40mph in 8.45secs Old variator + 15g: Same as above ^ no difference at full throttle. Koso 15g: Weaker acceleration from 0-40; I actually felt the bike start pulling harder after 40mph when the revs started going up. 0-40mph in 10 secs Koso 13g: Acceleration is mostly back. 0-40mph in 9 secs
I'm not really sure what to think at the moment... I'm a bit bummed out that the new variator hasn't increased my top speed at all. It has been a fun experience experimenting with all this though.
Last Edit: Dec 11, 2015 15:28:50 GMT -6 by rosiemoto
You did not check how high the belt is traveling: That is about what I expected out of 13 gram weights. IMO I think your scoot will do better with lighter weights. Keep this in mind you need RPMS to get up to speed with the KOSO once you get up to speed you can then back off on the throttle and cruise at that speed with a lot less rpms.
I can cruise around at 50 mph at 5100-5200 and at 60mph at 6100-6200 rpms BUT I crank it up little over 7K to get to that speed quickly then I can back off and am at half throttle. Alleyoop
Here's the results of the marker test you wanted me to do... both looked the same to me:
I like what you're describing about the Koso backing off the RPMs at cruise. My old variator definitely didn't do that with the 13g. Would you say I should have with this variator? With this in mind: 15g = 4800rpm, 13g = 5400rpm, so I'm guessing 11g= 6000rpm?? Should I go LIGHTER than 11g?
Last Edit: Dec 11, 2015 15:49:07 GMT -6 by rosiemoto
With that test, I revved each past the point where it rattles loud (7200rpm), so I was probably redlining or close. I made sure when it was up there, it was WOT, but I didn't hold it because I just don't feel it would be enjoying that. I did repeat each 2 or 3 times just to make sure. It just seems like the belt doesn't want to go any higher even with this new variator.
If it helps, I notice my rollers don't seem to affect anything above 43mph where it then "locks into gear."
Wait a minute!! are you doing this while it is on the center stand? You have to ride it and run it at WOT to put a load on the motor. The motor will run a lot different on the center stand without a load than when a load it put on it.
You talk as if you do not have a tach, the RED LINE is 8000K on the GY6 scoots and you should be able to see the tach as you twist the throttle if your running it on the center stand and or when your riding.
WHAT IS THIS ABOUT LOUD RATTLING? Where is the rattling coming from? Can you get a VIDEO of this rattling?
Your right when the mph gets to around 40 that is when the belt has climbed the highest in the variator and after that the scoot picks up speed because the RPMS starts to climb and of course as the rpms climb it turns the Variator Faster but the belt is already as high as it will climb. Alleyoop
I get in trouble because I call some of them out to prove it and they never do. 
I get in trouble because I call some of them out to prove it and they never do. 
..BAD TO THE BONE..
. All I can tell you is I like the KOSO it produces good low end and good top end for my Trike. I have tried some expensive Variators like the PRODIGY and DR2 I also have tried the KS which is like the PRODIGY. And out of all of them I like the KOSO which is very cheap compared to other performance variators. The DR2 I paid over $100.00 dollars I even wrote up a thread about it. I sold the DR2 to someone on this forum for half the price and threw in a brand new 24mm carb and a bunch of weights of different grams felt sorry for the dude.
