No start. No anything. By olivertwisted (Read 9,148 times)

[Alleyoop]

Back a few post you said this.

When I connect to the start switch the ground to frame that I hooked in, Key on, I get a turn over both positions of the kill switch.

What was not tested is if in BOTH you had spark which is the important thing. You would want to have NO SPARK in one of the positions and SPARK in the other.
Alleyoop

[olivertwisted]

Well , after a few days of hospitals and DRs for my Mother, it's kinda good to be back to this problem, ha! She's doing a bit better for now

Alleyoop

Here's what I get with a solenoid/spark check, CDI plugged in.

With the start switch wired STOCK:

KILL on STOP= I get Spark and solenoid

KILL on RUN= NO solenoid so, no spark.

( At that above, I get what you mean, it's operating opposite the way it should except, as I understand it, it should also turn over on KILL/STOP but not spark)

If I ADD a frame ground to the start switch ground and I get:

KILL on STOP= I get Spark and solenoid BUT THIS happened before and I thought it was just my rickety connection of the frame ground jumped onto the start switch ground, the spark is INTERMITTENT.

KILL on RUN = Solenoid- YES, Spark-NO.

[olivertwisted]

Mar 1, 2016 18:33:53 GMT -6 Alleyoop said:

Doing that will not activate the Solenoid unless you squeeze the brakes and push the start button the only difference is the PUSH BUTTON will always be grounded already killswitch off or on."
Is that to say that grounding that wire could be a possible permanent workaround in the event that I cannot isolate and fix the issue?

YES to your question.

The only thing is WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO KILL THE MOTOR.

So I would steady the switch OPENED up and with a diagram of the wires as if plugged in or plugged in if you can do that with the switch open and SEE which contacts get touched when moving the switch to RUN and NOT RUN.
Since you said the KILLWIRE you plugged back into the CDI and it sparks when it is in the OFF position. maybe the plugs are just backwards and in NOT RUN position the contacts are touching the g/w and ground. So maybe just turn the pluggs around in the same slot.

Sorry, I'm a bit confused because the notations suggest to "flip" the plug at the upper right in the pic, so that the G/W is on the side where the arrow points. To understand, do you mean to move the pins? Because, the G/W will be further from that slot if I flip it. If nothing bad could happen then, I could just try it and make a wish though!
  Unfortunately, I'm doubting that I have the intuitiveness to even make sense of things when I DO open the switch . I'm hunting the net for diagram that I can understand and follow to no avail, so far. Even better, a PIC of a switch and wires that are the colors of mine. YEAH, like "painting by numbers", THAT'S what I need! LOL!

[olivertwisted]

So, I did flip the connectors , inside their own slots.
I get nothing at all either way when pressing the start switch, UNTIL I add a frame ground to the G/W on the start switch.
So then, I get:
KILL on STOP= Solenoid and Spark

KILL on RUN = Solenoid, no spark.

I'm gonna stare at my notes, and a pic of the switch for a while and see if I can't make my head spin faster! LOL!.

[Alleyoop]

Sorry to hear about your MOM, good to hear she is doing better.

Ok, the way it is working is ok, on some scoots nothing happens on the NO RUN position NO SOLENOID.

Now let me ask this THE KILL SWITCH which way is NO RUN - TO THE LEFT? or TO THE RIGHT?

Reason I ask is ON YOUR SCOOTER I can show you a VIDEO where he starts his scoot and he PUSHS the KILLSWITCH to the LEFT = RUN Position. So it may bae your switch is miss labaled or the wrong switch for that scoot and we have been pulling our hair for NOT

[olivertwisted]

Thank you, Alleyoop !
She's up there in years now with a few conditions, so she needs a lil more, nowadays

That question has plagued me this entire journey ! I have hunted for an identical example for mine, from the beginning. I've got the original switch opened up right now, splayed on a dinner tray, and trying to map out the contacts on it (They are so tiny, it is very hard to see where the contacts are touching when you mate the pieces), along with a crude drawn map of the ignition system circuits in the works.I too, have seen different orientations for the kill switch. Even the one that came in my package of switches is smaller than my original and I suspect, may be different inside so, I'm stickin' with the original switch for now, so that we can at least know that all the contacts are there for my wires.
Last night, I was retesting the KILL wire (Unplugged,where it goes into the CDI) for ground and got that confusing reading again ( - 18xx) in one direction of the killswitch. I think that I had read that if my probes are backward, I can get a (-) sign to my reading and that it is "Null" to the reading but, I don't understand what would give me the "1836" or so, in the reading . So, not being SURE of my switch orientation , it skews my confidence in everything related to it.
What's really crazy to me about this is, this bike WAS running, and I didn't mess with the wiring much :/
Let me ask you this; Does it matter that there are several (4) grounds mounted to the same point of the frame, where the rectifier mounts? The battery , battery tender, frame to engine (valve cover ), and a smaller gauge GREEN wire that seems to head to the front within the harness but may be the one green bullet connector that is un-mated up front with no apparent mate for it. ALSO, on the other bolt at the rectifier mount, I have the ground wire that I put there for testing switches, etc;

.... Donald Rumsfeld
" There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know."

[Alleyoop]

Does this looks like yours? notice he pushs the switch to the LEFT to START IT.
That unmated GREEN GROUND wire might be the culprit. So look really good for a connector.

I have looked at a lot of the RIGHT HAND SWITCHS and so far ALL OF THEM - You Move the Switch to the LEFT TO START move the switch to the RIGHT TO KILL motor.
So I think you got the wrong switch if LEFT IS KILL and right is RUN. Which means use the OLD ONE if it works.

Those who do not know, do not know that they do not know.

[olivertwisted]

YES!!!! That one DOES! It's the best example , so far, COOL. I'll operate on that, with the old one , WHEN it's back together

And
THOSE WHOM, THINK THEY KNOW EVERYTHING ARE VERY ANNOYING,
TO THOSE OF US WHO DO !

[olivertwisted]

Oh yeah! I forgot to share the giggle!
Last night, my cat wouldn't leave me alone to concentrate on the switch opened up on my tray and I kept setting her aside. The last time she jumped up, she looked on the tray as if to say "Hmmm, what is it that is SO important here that I can't walk back and forth across her lap right now". She reached onto the tray one last time before I could stop her and she STOLE the tiny little BB that goes into the switch , and batted it around the house until neither of us could find it! LOL! I found it about 2 hours later

[Alleyoop]

HAHAHA, that's funny

[olivertwisted]

Yeah, it was ALL that I needed, at the moment!

Okay, I think I have these contacts figured out and it seems to support that the LEFT position is "RUN" and the right is "KILL". Let me mark up a pic and I'll show ya what I found

[Alleyoop]

FANTASTIC!!!! You should get a job with CSI MIAMI

[olivertwisted]

LOL! OR a one way ticket to the looney bin !

[Alleyoop]

So with that said If it operates the solenoid when pushed to the LEFT GREAT AND YOU HAVE SPARK and when pushed to the RIGHT NADA we in business. Now we can put that together and move on to the next problem child.

[olivertwisted]

So, with the switch In the LEFT position on the bike ,
G-1 and G/W are in contact in their plug, AND G-2 and the middle (No wire) in theirs.

With the switch at the RIGHT position on the bike,
G-1, G-2 and BW are contacted



(BOY, I hope I did this right. I may edit after I see it posted)