Bunch of Scooters Tested By kz1000st (Read 1,263 times)

[kz1000st]

www.motorcycle-usa.com/14/17464/Motorcycle-Article/2013--2000-Scooter-Comparison.aspx

I would take either of the Chinese built 125s over a bunch of overpriced 50cc models.

[markwb]

I like the Honda, but don't want to spend the money. That's why I have this one.

[FrankenMech]

Interesting.....

[LUKE]

kz, everytime a rider rides those alleged overpriced 50cc or any quality scooters, there's always a sense of Pride!...and that's what you are really paying for....self esteem is Priceless!

[pmatulew]

Another junk article by those MotorcycleUSA hacks. You can't put a 125 in with a bunch of 50's and then praise it for the extra power. Regardless of sticker price you have to go apples to apples. Plus they completely omitted mentioning the regulatory threshold that 50's skirt even though that's about the only selling point of a 50 to begin with.

[kz1000st]

The sense of pride you think is real is the same "Mystique", "If I have to explain it, you just don't understand", nonsense that Harley owners ramble on about. If a scooter does the same speed and stops just as hard, it's an equal. A Kymco is equal to a Vespa, Piaggio or an Aprilia. Heck, a Green Earth 50cc scooter is equal to a 35 mph Vespa. A Tao Tao is equal too. All this will stop when there are dozens of Chinese scooters topping 50,000 miles and it will happen. The same as "Rice Burning Jap Crap" stopped when big Japanese motorcycles all lasted longer than Harleys.

[LUKE]

just like the owner of this Burgman, he feels the sense of PRIDE everytime he rides , not because of the Burgman, it's because of the Milk crate that's attached to the back of his scooter. Im very very tempted to put one on mine...
but i might die of too much embarrassment if i do that. a milk crate,, gosh!

[randy]

Nov 25, 2013 9:57:54 GMT -6 kz1000st said:

www.motorcycle-usa.com/14/17464/Motorcycle-Article/2013--2000-Scooter-Comparison.aspx

I would take either of the Chinese built 125s over a bunch of overpriced 50cc models. [/quote
You guys always jump on Luke for defending his brand of choice then every chance you get you fuel the fire with load of B.S. that the China scoots are cheaper . Somethings up when the constant argument is price. Well I have worked on a lot of scooters and there is reason for the big difference in price. The China built scooters in general use thee cheapest parts known to mankind from the bolts that hold it together to the valve stems in the tires. How many of the overpriced scoots need ,belts ,valve stems batteries in the first few hundred miles. I paid $1800 for my overpriced Stella 4 years ago. It is worth MORE than that today. So that is pretty cheap ridding. With the "overpriced" scoots I think you have to take into account the resale value also. I have bought used entry level 150cc scoots with as little as 10 miles on them for $200 that the owner bought on line couldn't get it running and got digusted with the online dealer and bailed out on it.

[kz1000st]

The China built scooters in general use the cheapest parts known to mankind from the bolts that hold it together to the valve stems in the tires. How many of the overpriced scoots need ,belts ,valve stems batteries in the first few hundred miles.

Here's why we slam Luke. Motorcycle-USA didn't test a Znen, Bashan or JM Star 50cc. They tested a Kymco, Honda, Piaggio and Aprilia. Re-read the article. All three scooters owe something to China. The Kymco and Honda were built there, the Piaggio products were noted by the author as having running gear originating in the People's Republic.

I said, "I would take either of the Chinese built 125s over a bunch of overpriced 50cc models." My definition of a machine that only does 35 to 40 mph for $2000 is overpriced. I'm sorry you have such a problem with Chinese scooters, like Luke. I will tell you this. If I bought a Lance PCH 125 or 150cc from Cookees, or a Puma Falcon or Jakester 150 (Love those scoots), took it in for scheduled maintenance and didn't flog it like a rented mule it would last as long as any thing from anywhere.

[FrankenMech]

Luke, I have one of those $8 fold-down 32L totes I can bungee to my rear rack to hold something. Of course I don't carry it around unless I know I am going to need it. The baskets that I always carry around fold up flat and are semi-permanently mounted. The P-clamp screws have green loctite on them and are HELL to get loose. Each one will hold one of those cloth grocery bags. I have crammed 4 each 2L bottles in one basket but mostly they handle three 2L bottles. The fold-down tote may hold four grocery bags by itself. My scoot is strictly a grocery getter, not a weekend cruiser or commuter. I am considering putting one of my old plastic camp boxes on the rear if I can figure out a quick release mechanism. The camp box locks so I would not have to carry my purchases from one store into another. In my area anything I just left out sitting in a basket would be gone when I got back.

kz, My 50cc 30+/- mph China scoot did cost me nearly $2000 because of that second front wheel and I put more $$$ into it with mods. Nobody else had one. I waited two years for someone else to come out with a scoot like it so I would have a choice. The 3 baskets alone were $70 from Wald. The plastic box I cut down and stuck under the seat was $13. All the new front lights were about $80. The strobe lights were $16. I have a bunch of $$ in spare parts and lots of my time. It all adds up, but it is useful to me and a real blast to play with...

[sitticuss]

Everyone talks about Chinese scooters being cheap because all the parts etc are junk.... they never talk about how much they pay their workers or how their industry its self is different than other country's. I am impressed by their level of standardization which makes them more competitive. Anyone else remember back in the day when Honda motorcycles first came out in the us? they made the first bikes which where more tailored to everyday families along with a marketing campaign to change the way people in general viewed motorcycle riders. To be "brand" loyal is cool but face it parts come from everywhere to make up everything these days....

[LUKE]

i'd like to share with you a story why i like japan scoots....back in Asia i ride these 2 stroke japan made Honda Dio1. i bought it used, nobody in asia before buy brand new scoots, all our scoots comes straight from japan. these were surplus scooter, they were used by japanese kids during summer then come winter those scooters are being thrown in a surplus junkyard or some kids just leave them in the streets for somebody to pick it up... NOW some of my countrymen who works in japan as an exporter of produce(bananas/coconuts etc ) load those scooters in the container van (hapag Lloyd or Maersk line)together with the bananas etc.,they were ship in my country(illegally if you may call it) at the port of entry they already have their contacts, those scooters probably 5units are being put inside a sack and thrown to the shore, now the guys who bought them will pick them up from the shore, they will dry them up and make them run...
now can you imagine this...a scooter,ridden in japan for 5years max, thrown in the junkyard, submerged in water AND STILL RUNS? the big question is===can you do that on a chinese scooter?


and oh, i rode my honda dio1 for many years and many miles, i abused it. and the only mechanical thing that i need to do is to replace the piston which is normal when you want to attain the best compression, its a part of wear and tear after so many years of using it...the block is still intact tho.
electronics are still in best shape. i dunno how it survive being soaked in water but it was there i saw it and i rode it...i am a living witness of its durability. and it goes to every japanese scooters and mc's.

NOW, i have really nothing against people wanting to ride chinese scoots,it's their money, i dont care...but for example on KZ's case, there's always a BIG question mark in my mind why this person, who has been riding for 40years,has ridden a lot of motorcycles, i mean he has been up there when it comes to two wheel world,has torn apart and repaired a lot of engines of different brands. my question is WHY does he WORSHIP AND ADORE chinese scooters considering his stature.,and of course we all know how the quality of a chinese scooter is..cum'on, i just cant believe it.
now, JCT, didn't have any issues with his Majesty aside from he said waiting for parts which takes 2 or more weeks to arrive, but the problem there is that he is just being impatient..LOL

are you two a stockholder of some chinese scooter company? or getting money form some dealers everytime you back up or praise chinese scoots in a forum? why? why are you worshiping chinese scoots?


and what??? are you comparing Znen,bashan,JM star with Kymco,Honda,Piaggio and Aprilla?? my goodness!!!
Motorcycle USA should not even waste their time testing these...omg, i don't wanna say it..LOL

respect my----->IMO

now the floor is yours....

[FrankenMech]

We ALL have our reasons for riding our scoot of choice. I can remember back in the 50-60's when Japanese products were cheap junk made in factories that the US paid to rebuild and filled with a desperate, and cheap, workforce. On the other hand we did not rebuild our own factories after the WWII and our production costs soared. In the 70-80's Japanese goods reached a point of excellence few but the Germans have matched. Every developing or recovering country goes through the same cheap labor manufacturing and export cycle. They continually learn and get better while polluting their 'nest'. Personally I think China is at that turning point where their product quality increases drastically and at the same time they start cleaning up their act in the environment and labor force. Taiwan went through it 10 years back. We have our own problems in this country bringing cost effective and environmentally sound manufacturing back. We have some examples to follow out there but everyone has problems of some sort. We just need to work together for the common good and put bias aside.

BTW, the build quality, parts, fasteners, and QC on my China scoot is a real mixed bag. I can live with it at the moment.

[kz1000st]

OK, no I don't own stock in anything. Now maybe, somewhere, there is Chinese junk, not in my garage. My Bashan 150 came from the factory with a mis-welded header pipe and it caused problems that cracked my valve springs. I goofed putting it back together and it caused a string of problems, THAT I CAUSED. If I had let someone with better tools and more experience reassemble the scooter it would not have leaked oil. Even at that it rolled along for three years, leaking oil and running like a Champ. I've seen the inside of my scooter. The electrical connections and wiring is fine, the frame is solid and built well and the metal it's made from real alloys, not flimsy Pot Metal, as certain "Experts" have declared. The scooter works and will continue to work for a loooong time.
I have owned numerous Japanese bikes and let me tell you, none of them was perfect. My 1974 500 triple rattled like the devil.I had to spend a half hour every month re-tightening engine, exhaust and other mounting bolts to keep them from falling off. It shook so bad a headlight bulb lasted two years, tops, before the filaments broke. It also was a sealed beam built only for the bike and cost about four times what a sealed beam costs for a car. It fouled the number three plug every three thousand miles and smoked like crop duster. Loved tromping on Sportsters with it, it was the perfect self esteem sweller.
My KZ1000st weighed 600 pounds. Try picking that up. It wore out both brake switches by 70,000 miles and dry rotted its seat in five years and blew a rear end seal at 50,000 miles. OK it was the perfect bike but a replacement for it would cost me $14,000 today and I don't need 600 pounds and 140 horsepower.
My W650 was a pain in the neck. It shook and cracked its rear fender because it was made from cheap tin with chrome. It was a known defect, but Kawasaki wouldn't repair it even though if it broke completely the tail light would go with it. The battery was buried deep inside the frame and took twenty minutes to remove. The battery was smaller in size than my 150 and burned up every two years.

And Luke. I owned a Japanese bike that was underwater too. The Big Ruckus was loaded inside the engine with rust, the clutch bearing BROKE after it rusted through and the EGR valve rotted away letting exhaust gases blow out through a second exhaust pipe. The $400 catalytic converter exhaust pipe rotted out and blew exhaust sideways onto the rear wheel leaving internal rust coating the back wheel. That was all I saw in the brief time I owned it and I'll bet in time other nasty issues would have cropped up leaving it dead.

Nothing, and I mean nothing, is perfect. My Chinese stuff is all approaching 10,000 miles and cost me less in total than any Japanese scooter bigger than 100cc.

And Frank.....I meant 50cc on two wheels. I think purpose built trikes at the price the Chinese get is a miracle. You can't buy them from any other country and for all the bits and metal involved they're practically free. These reverse trikes at less than $2500 are just insane. I'm betting Japanese spies are all over China trying to figure them out.

[randy]

The china built scoots have a place in the market as long as the buyer knows what he is getting into ie;no dealer or part support. The average dealer doesn't usually know who the manufacture is and will advertise and compare it to a Vespa.China scoots are much less to purchase than allot of other scoots but with that are short falls. A person with some mechanical skills that enjoys working and maintaining his scoot will be fine.I have seen the behind the walls of a drop shipper and it was amazing the amount of scoots he sold and knew nothing about them. I have benefited several times from people wanting a scoot and price shop then get disappointed and hold a fire sale. My 50 year old Vespa is still alive and kicking,runs, shifts and stops fine,and parts are cheap and plentiful after 50 years! The guys on here want to compare there $700 scoots to,Honda,Kymco,Vespa etc based on price alone and it can't compare on that basis.But it does very well for guy that wants to get into scooting and not spend a butt load cash and is aware of the teething pains associated with it. I don't bash the China scoots but some guys on here every chance they get want to compare the China scoots to other name brand scoots on the basis of price alone. Different strokes for different folks. And I prefer two with a shifter.