Starter Solenoid Wiring By potwashman (Read 9,295 times)

[potwashman]

Hi, I have had my Superbyke Powermax 50 (HT50QT-31) for 5 mnths and have been using kick start only as the electric start had been disabled (the 2 wires to the solenoid had been cut, on mine they are Yellow/Red & Yellow/Green). Just replaced my kickstart gear as teeth were worn so figured I'd sort out the wiring so have 2 starting options.

Problem is where do the wires get attached to as there isn't any corresponding wires on the harness that I can see to connect them to. Is one an earth and does the other one connect to the CDI unit? Only reason I ask this is that my CDI unit is a six pin version but on the female terminal that connects to it there are only 5 wires leading in, leaving a spare male pin on the CDI.

Also, a couple of months ago I upgraded engine from 50cc to 80cc. Would I need a higher Amp battery to start it as the existing one (brand new LB4L-B, 12v 4ah) doesn't seem to have enough 'oomph' to spin the variator pulley fast enough (I connected some wiring with a push button starter to the Solenoid). After not many attempts it seems to just run out of juice. In past few days I've put on a new starter motor (old one was probably fine), and a new solenoid is in the post to me.

I can put a new push button starter on the dash and wire directly to the solenoid terminals as I did to test but so far not worked and I would prefer to use existing wiring/starter button.


Any advice would be appreciated, thanks.

[potwashman]

Wish I'd spent another 10mins on bike before posting!!. Found the corresponding wires tucked away near the fuel tank inside a rubber boot. Got wires connected and now the starter button works but still not firing up (only on kick start). Before I invest in a new higher amp battery do you think it'd be a good idea to try using my car battery to see if it will fire up (12v but much more cranking power). Aside from the battery & solenoid I don't know what it can be (but I'm sure quite a few of you have figured I'm not the brightest spark so I'm sure it could be a ton of other things too).

Thanks

[Bashan]

Well since you mentioned spark, have you checked yours? Pull the plug, put it back in the boot, make sure your killswitch is set to run, hold the electrode on the valve cover or good frame spot, hit the start button you just fixed, look for a nice blue spark, and don't sell yourself short, there's lots of people that didn't figure out that those wires needed to be hooked up, I'm not kidding.


This is from the troubleshooting library at Scooter Depot. Many thanks to them for their fine spark check video. The link will take you to photobucket where you can use the full screen icon. Rich

CLICK ABOVE FOR VIDEO LINK

Here's how the wiring works. The start button grounds the circuit to the solenoid armature which closes the circuit from the battery to the starter. The brake must be pulled in to energize the start button:

In answer to your other question, you can use a truck battery to jump a scooter or anything else. A circuit only draws the current that it needs. But DO NOT have the jump vehicle running, it will toast the scooters electrics. If the vehicle is running the scooter's extra draw ramps the jump vehicles alternator and sends a shot of juice through the scooter's wiring. Snif snif...what's burning?

[tvnacman]

since you did a BBK from 50 to 80cc your compression is up . Your ignition timming and increased compression is making it hard to crank . There are two ways to tackle this: 1) hi torque starter , that will stress your starter clutch/bendix or 2) use a variable timing cdi (it retards the timing at idle/start up then gives you nice advance at about 3000rpm .

Keep in mind you will need a good charged battery .

www.nycscooterparts.com/#!product/prd1/1534128405/performance-cdi <----cut and paste the entire link

John

[potwashman]

Thanks for replies. I've just connected my car battery to it and it fired up straight away on electric start so I guess I need a battery with higher ampage than the existing 4amp battery. Any suggestions on high high to go (battery compartment can take a bit bigger battery but if I need one that's too big for compartment I can move to space under seat.

Thanks

[Bashan]

Good eye by John, I didn't notice that he went to a BBK. You wouldn't believe how much more cranking power you need to push against those cam lobes. Take your plug out (I'm not going to be happy until you do that) put a wrench on your crank (ouch) and rotate the engine. When you hit the lobes you'll feel the resistance.

John, can you see if that is the link you want in your post? I tried to fix the one that was in there and inadvertently deleted it. Sorry man, Rich

[tvnacman]

see if your car battery fits under your seat , your going to need it .

I see I suggest checking your battery is fully charged you jump it and now you need a bigger battery . I can see how you got there , you might as well order a spare starter and starter clutch/bendix . Working the timing angle is the way to go .

Rich I saw and fixed it . I swear I posted this reply before too .

John

[Alleyoop]

Feb 2, 2014 10:27:34 GMT -6 potwashman said:

Thanks for replies. I've just connected my car battery to it and it fired up straight away on electric start so I guess I need a battery with higher ampage than the existing 4amp battery. Any suggestions on high high to go (battery compartment can take a bit bigger battery but if I need one that's too big for compartment I can move to space under seat.

Thanks

Measure your battery compartment and get at LEAST a 7AMP-9AMP battery BUT get one that has HIGH CCA's (COLD CRANKING AMPS) one that has WELL over 100 Cranking AMPS. That is all you will need, they sell a lot of 7-9 amp batteries cheap but the CCA's are under 100 and that will act just like your current battery it will spin a couple of times and drain all the juice out of it with just a couple of hits.
Alleyoop

[Bashan]

If I can second what Alley said, get the biggest, most powerful battery you can fit in the box, you will not hurt anything. The bike will only draw what it needs, the extra juice will not go flooding down the cables and fry the electrics. Think of your battery as a water tower. The volts are the height of the tower, the greater the volts the higher the tower and the greater the pressure/push on the electrons. A 12 volt system has a certain amount of push and adding more batteries at the same height increases capacity but not push. Your stator turns mechanical energy into electrical energy. It can move X amount of electrons. The size of the "well" it is sending them to doesn't make it work harder, it just has more room to fill up with water/"electrons". The bigger battery, or indeed the addition of more batteries, does not change the fundamental characteristics of your bike's electrics. The generation and usage factors remain the same.

[potwashman]

Hi, I've ordered a 7amp AGM battery with 130cca so hopefully that will sort it out.

Thanks for replies