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Post by sprocket on Jan 12, 2012 20:01:18 GMT -6
Just a note ...Bashan's diagram for the R/R is correct...
ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL.. the manuals for these engines are wrong!
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Clinician
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Post by 72nova on Jan 13, 2012 7:44:11 GMT -6
Rich sorry for the confusing info. I tried to post a picture of the CDI that came with new engine, if it will not take it. I will try again. The picture I sent of the wires on the CDI, has been on the kart from the beginning never changed. The new engine has a plug with 3 wires in it and a single wire that is Blue/White. The old engine has the same kind of plug with 3 wires in it but there 2 separate wires, one is Red/Black and the other is Blue/Yellow. Both of these wires go to the CDI. Now after reading everything here you all have written I think I need to start over and try to bring everyone up to speed. You all have very helpful I just can't get back to the computer fast enough to get your information. Thanks Bret Well I am going to have to try and get this picture smaller so please be patient with me. I may have to draw it on paper
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Post by Bashan on Jan 13, 2012 12:17:49 GMT -6
You might try an imaging service such as Photobucket, it's free. Attachments can be a PITA and Proboards is real hinky about the size. Here's a tutorial for Photobucket.
If you mean the old engine has one plug with three wires that are yellow, white, and green, those wires go to the R/R. Then the two seperate wires are red/black=AC power feed, and blue/yellow=trigger. On the new engine the same applies except the blue/white is a trigger for a DC powered CDI. You'd have to have a DC CDI and run a DC wire from the ignition to the power plug. I think Sprocket suggested getting the stator off of the old engine, putting it on the new, and wire it with an AC CDI. I think that's good advice. Rich
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Post by 72nova on Jan 13, 2012 18:49:56 GMT -6
Ok I am still not up to speed with this forum stuff, but am trying. I must have everyone good and confused by now. I am sorry for that maybe I need to start over. I believe my Crosffire is an AC ignition system. I believe that the engine I bought is a DC system. The CDI you pictured that has the green conector on it is what they sent with engine. I only have a Blue/White wire from the stator the Red/Black is not there on new engine. I hope this helps Bret
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Post by Alleyoop on Jan 13, 2012 19:32:43 GMT -6
Yea the engine probably has a DC stator, The easiest thing for you to do is take out the Stator from the New engine and put in the STATOR from the old engine THEN it will just be PLUG AND PLAY. Otherwise you will be rewireing things and you will also need a different Regulator/Rectfier as well for the DC system. Alleyoop
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Post by 72nova on Jan 13, 2012 20:26:25 GMT -6
Well the problem is I have written so much I need to try & clear it up. When the old engine lost spark I changed the CDI, Rectifier, & Coil. The white wire from stator to rectifier is the wire that melted. Replaced that terminal on that wire with all of the new parts, still no spark. I had no way to test stator & no way to remove the stator. So I ordered a new engine & this one has only 4 wires total from stator. May old engine had 5 wires. I am afraid I will wind up with no spark if the stator from the old engine is bad. What tool is needed to remove the stator? Can I test the stator by cranking it over with the starter. I hope this makes more since. Thanks again for all of your help with my problem, I am sure you are getting tied of this redundant writing.
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Post by Alleyoop on Jan 14, 2012 1:19:57 GMT -6
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Post by Bashan on Jan 14, 2012 6:52:27 GMT -6
Well thanks for the compliment Alley. 72nova (I think I drove one of them for a while.... ) here is a Photobucket pic of your attachment cropped:
Mike at Buggy Parts NW sells all kinds of things for buggies and his CDIs are wired just like a scooter. In fact, he sells a lot of parts to scooter owners on the forum. His CDIs are plug and play for scooters. So I really can't imagine your buggy CDI is as different in that photo from a scooter as it seems, if it is we can't help you. I hope that yellow wire isn't coming from the stator with AC power, that's supposed to be the killwire. A blue wire is trigger pulse from the stator on a scooter but that one is plugged into where the coil feed comes from. The green ground and red/black AC power are correct which would make me think the CDI is GY6 fare. Who did you buy the engine from? An internet dealer?
OK, I've got another question that we need answered. Is there a three wire harness on BOTH the old and new engine that has a green, white, and yellow wire ending in a three plug? Never mind the other wires, just is there that harness? Rich
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Post by 72nova on Jan 14, 2012 8:17:00 GMT -6
Ok Rich the yellow wire is the Kill Switch. The Blue wire is the Coil feed from my CDI. The Green wire goes to the Ignition Switch and the wiring looks to me like it completes the ground for the engine to crank. The Red/Black is from the stator. The Black/White in the upper left next to the Blue wire is also coming from the stator, on the old engine. Ok they both have the three wire harness same plug just different color wires. The new engine has one wire seperate out of the stator and the old engine has 2 wires seperate from the stator. The 3 wire harness plugs in to rectifier harness.
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Post by Bashan on Jan 14, 2012 11:26:26 GMT -6
The wire colors on the original CDI are pretty much wrong. However, their function is standard GY6 from what you said:
That black/white coming from the stator on your attachment is the trigger pulse, I'm sure of that. The killwire grounds out the spark to frame regardless of what it's hooked up to, ignition or killswitch. The green ground goes right to the frame on my scooter.
The three wire harness for the rectifier from the stator should be the same regardless of a DC or AC CDI. You'll have a wire that will test right to frame at about 20v AC, that's usually the white. The yellow is about 15v AC, and the green is the ground.
Your problem is the new engine has a stator for a DC CDI with just a trigger pulse wire, plus the three wire harness for the rectifier. The old is wired for AC which has a trigger pulse wire AND an AC feed, plus the three wire harness for the rectifier. You're going to have to figure out which way you want it, DC or AC and go from there. The wiring diagram I supplied earlier will work either way, it shows both. If you go AC you'll have to get your old AC stator off or return the engine and have them send you one wired for AC. There's no easy solutions here and your going to have to do some serious wiring. Rich
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Post by sprocket on Jan 14, 2012 13:17:02 GMT -6
If the engine came from Ebay it is 98% likely to have a DC stator...I agree Rich
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Post by 72nova on Jan 14, 2012 18:22:51 GMT -6
OK YOU GUYS Bashan, Alleyoop, and most of all Sprocket for the wiring diagram of the DC - CDI. If I had 4 hands I would give you all 4 thumbs up. I wired the new engine as a DC and it runs great, Now I need to get new front tires, My daughter is so happy I got her Kart going again. You Guys ROCK. I think after all my checking of the switch system I am sure the ignition switch is bad, that may have been the problem with old engine all the time. Thanks Again Bret
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Post by Alleyoop on Jan 14, 2012 18:39:07 GMT -6
FANTASTIC 72NOVA, Now for TIPS AND TRICKS, Take pictures and EXPLAIN how you wire an AC scooter to work with a DC STATOR. That will help a ton of guys when they also run into the same problem and that is an engine or stator they bought is a DC stator. Would be much appreciated from all of us. This way there is no Well Try this and try that. Alleyoop
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Post by 72nova on Jan 14, 2012 21:01:14 GMT -6
You bet tomorrow I am going to clean up the wires and try to send the pictures. I need to install an ignition switch. I used a horn button to ground the the starter solenoid for cranking the engine. I bought this engine from Amazon but it came from T-motorsport. I may try to wire up the old engine to see if I can get it started. thanks again for our help
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Post by 72nova on Jan 14, 2012 21:07:10 GMT -6
That should read "Your Help" not "our '"help, you guys helped me
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