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Post by cavenger on Jul 5, 2015 8:59:08 GMT -6
My ground running from the engine and to the battery are tight and clean now. This has made no difference. I guess it is possible one of the cables is bad. I haven't gotten to the point of testing cables yet.
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Post by cavenger on Jul 5, 2015 8:57:25 GMT -6
I seem to recall Rich saying something about hiding a kill switch somewhere on the bike. I saw one in the video you posted. I'm not sure if he ever did install it, but it doesn't sound like it's a problem with you getting a solid CLICK when you hit the start button. Take a big fat wire and bolt it to part of the engine where the starter is and the other end to the neg side of the battery. Then try and start it. If it is a ground issue, that will make it obvious. Just noting that I already have a dedicated cable running from the start mount to the ground point. Do you think I should run it to the battery instead? |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 22:18:38 GMT -6
Question....the connection where these grounds are coming to the frame. There is a lot of grease there, is that normal? Should I clean it?
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 21:37:43 GMT -6
Remember the starter is mounted on the motor so all you have to do is GROUND the motor to the FRAME. So Get a piece of wire and bolt it to one of the bolts on the VALVE COVER of the motor and then to the frame. I am sure the battery and some other wires you will find bolted to the frame usually on the RIGHT side of the scoot. So look for GREEN and BLACK WIRES bolted to the frame on the right side and that is your ground spot. Alleyoop ok...I found the grounds.....they were on the right side. There were 2 cables attached to the frame. One from the battery and one from the motor. They were already tight so I went ahead and tried ootscoots suggestion of a ground cable directly to the starter bolts. I did it from the same ground spot as where the others were connected. It didn't work. Still the same one click each time I hit the starter. I verified that I have 11.7 going to the starter terminal each time I click the start button. Argh. |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 20:03:18 GMT -6
I was the SYM dealer for Pittsburgh. The bike was my personal ride. Rich gave me the "poor puppydog look" so I sold it to him! We had it shipped down to him using Uship. Actually, I think I've sent down some 5 scoots for him and Sue. Great story! |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 19:23:07 GMT -6
I guess the most important thing I have to do at this point is find the grounds. I traced the wires but they are all under sheathing. It looks like the green wire from the battery goes towards the front of the bike under in this sheathing. Then I guess I will try ootscoot's idea of directly grounding the starter mount points. I have a cable to do it but I can't see a spot to ground it.
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 17:48:52 GMT -6
By all means Check BOTH GROUNDS a wire from the motor to the frame and a wire from the NEG post of the battery to the frame than all should be good as MAJOR GROUNDS go. Alleyoop Next time also connect the MULTI METER to the battery and when you go and crank it check what the voltage drops to if it drops below 10 volts that is not good and is why it stops after only a couple of good cranks. What matters with the batteries is the CCA's(COLD CRANKING AMPS) you want to get a battery rated WELL OVER 100 CCA's close to 200 or higher would be great. The cheaper batteries the CCA's are low so you only get a couple of good cranks before it depletes the amps in the battery and you have to recharge it. Anything 7AH and up is fine like I mentioned the important thing is the rated CCA's. If close to 100 or lower than 100 that will not do the job on a motor that requires a few cranks to get it to start. Alleyoop I'm gonna find the grounds somehow. The CCA rating on this battery is 180. And... Before turning key multimeter 12.2 volts or so. Turned key only about 11.2 and when hitting starter also about 11.2. |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 17:42:19 GMT -6
By all means Check BOTH GROUNDS a wire from the motor to the frame and a wire from the NEG post of the battery to the frame than all should be good as MAJOR GROUNDS go. Alleyoop Next time also connect the MULTI METER to the battery and when you go and crank it check what the voltage drops to if it drops below 10 volts that is not good and is why it stops after only a couple of good cranks. What matters with the batteries is the CCA's(COLD CRANKING AMPS) you want to get a battery rated WELL OVER 100 CCA's close to 200 or higher would be great. The cheaper batteries the CCA's are low so you only get a couple of good cranks before it depletes the amps in the battery and you have to recharge it. Anything 7AH and up is fine like I mentioned the important thing is the rated CCA's. If close to 100 or lower than 100 that will not do the job on a motor that requires a few cranks to get it to start. Alleyoop I'm gonna find the grounds somehow. The CCA rating on this battery is 180. |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 16:12:17 GMT -6
Ok what you want to do is Put the battery in the scoot connect everything and put the charger on it set it at 2amps. Wait about 5 minutes and LEAVE the charger connected and try to start it and see if it spins the starter. Alleyoop It turned a few times but then stopped and then wouldn't do it again. The battery charger says it is charged. What does that mean? ooscoot suggested this: I had the exact same issue on one Citycom - starter worked fine on the bench, but would only give a turn or two when in the bike. Check the frame to engine ground and it appeared ok, but just to make sure, I ran another ground wire from the frame to the starter mounting bolt - bike fired right up. Somehow the engine ground was isolated to the front half of engine (bike had spark). |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 15:51:23 GMT -6
Ok what you want to do is Put the battery in the scoot connect everything and put the charger on it set it at 2amps. Wait about 5 minutes and LEAVE the charger connected and try to start it and see if it spins the starter. Alleyoop ok I will do that. I double checked the starter and it spun like crazy once I had a good connection to it. But I think when I said it spun in the bike earlier, I believe that was just enough for it to catch its teeth but then it stopped. I will do what you suggested above. Can you tell me how many ah battery I should have on this scooter? ootscoot had suggested i need a 12ah or 14ah battery. The manual for this scooter says 10ah and it has a 10.5. I am trying to see if I am going to try to get a battery before 6 pm when the autoparts store closes. This is getting to be maddening. |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 14:34:00 GMT -6
UPDATE: ok...so I just couldn't get a good connection on the starter when it was in the bike to test it. I have a crappy pair of jumper cables. So I pulled the starter out and tested it hooked up to the bike battery and my car battery and in both cases, it spun.
So I put it back in the bike and just tested it and the bike made 2 cranks and stopped and wouldn't crank again. So I was like ok....I need to put the hose back on and make sure everything is clamped down and try it again. It did the same one click thing again. So I checked the battery volts and it was a bit low by now so I just put it back on the charger and I have some small level of hope that it will start after it gets charged. If it doesn't, I may have to try again to test the starter in the bike.
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 10:13:38 GMT -6
Geez, I feel bad. I put the first 1000 miles on that scoot, Rich put on the rest. I wish I could help, but as I used to explain to our customers, my partner Mike could fix your scooter....I could do your taxes. Knowing that Rich kept that scooter meticulously maintained, I can only think that it has to be something simple and stupid. BTW, The Citycom 300 is a HUGE leap for a novice scooter rider. When you do get it started, please be careful. That scooter "shiats and gits" Good Luck! Thanks Cookees! I have to agree that it is probably something simple... But no luck as of yet. I had heard you were the previous owner. Do you mind telling me where you got it and how Rich came to get it? I know it is a big bike to start on. I have ridden it shortly 3 times and I think it's gonna be great. I am taking my msf course next weekend and I plan on going sloooowwww starting out. I also need to get full safety gear to even think about very fast. I appreciate the kind words and I will keep you updated! |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 6:25:41 GMT -6
My plan for today is to try these things:
1. I really want to try to make sure I have properly tested the starter in the bike before I pull it. I am not sure if I did it right. I do know it is getting power when the starter button is pressed. My testing of the solenoid seems to indicate it is good as well.
2. Check the ground from the battery to the frame. Tried once but I guess I need to take the right side flaring off. to actually see it because I can't see it with just the luggage box off. If anyone know where it attaches to this bike, please let me know.
3. Try to see if there are any other wires that are lose or frayed like John suggested from the stator.
4. Pull the starter and bench test it. It looks like I have to remove the air hose and then two bolts to remove it. Is this something a local auto parts store is going to have or am I going to have to order it online?
Thanks everyone!
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Post by cavenger on Jul 4, 2015 6:06:18 GMT -6
look to see if the the green wire from the stator is burned. John This is like a lesson in scooter repair. Now I need to figure out where the stator is..lol. I will try a little later to dig into it again. |
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Post by cavenger on Jul 3, 2015 21:37:40 GMT -6
Here is how I setup the test. I disconnected the battery completely from its regular cables. I then connected the positive to positive of the battery and negative to negative of the battery. Then connected the other end of the jumper cables negative to metal on the bike and then the positive to most obvious post I could see on the starter. I did not disconnect the cable that came from the solenoid into the starter. I got nothing from the starter. I made sure i had power on the starter post and it was over 12. Here is a pic of how I set it up:  I have yet to be able to find where the ground wire goes to the bike from the battery. |
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