research nut - diff between cfmoto & linhai engine By grocerygetter (Read 4,697 times)

[grocerygetter]

Newbie - didn't want to start another new "What should I buy" thread, but I have specific Q's that I haven't come across on the forum yet. Great forum BTW.

I Belong to Lincolns Online and write some repair articles with pics, Ford Truck Enthusiasts forum, Dodge Magnum forums, and recently due to our wonderful Gov't game of gas prices - a Saturn forum. BTW - untill a couple months ago, the Lincoln was the grocery getter, now the Saturn, soon to be the scooter...

I can turn a wrench, though I'm getting tired of it.
Owning a few vehicles and a camper keeps one 'wrenching' fulltime after work - need some playtime.
I can walk you thru drilling out broken exhaust manifold studs that rot and break, and install quality headers on a V10 F250 - but have no clue around small engines and appreciate the knowledge and experience of others here on the forum.

So, buddy at work got me looking into scooters after I put $136 into my gas tank when it still had about an 1/8 left last week. Have never had one, got the bug just researching.
Will be great for my 8mile roundtrip commute, some small shopping, not to mention using around a campground.
We started looking at 150's, then I figured 250 would better suit my 230lbs(did I say that out loud) + a passenger.

The more I looked, the more questions I got.
So it seems there's quite a game with these.
I zero'd in on the ROKETA MC-54B - cheaper;
But it seems there's a variant - MC_SL22 - more expensive

I can't get good consistent info - does one have a cfmoto engine and the other a Linhai?

Is the Linhai better?
I don't want to have to adjust valves more because I unknowingly chose an inferior motor.
What kind of mileage are we typically at when valves require adjustment, or do you just do it when performance isn't there?

Is it possible to not be able to control what engine these come with due to manufacturers parts supply?
I read on the forum that a fellow was anticipating to get the same model scoot with engine B but got engine A - the Honda clone I think.

I have many more questions - already worte a book here so I'll stop at that.
If you have details, I love em and have the time
Thanks
Ron

[madcollie]

Well WELCOME GG,

First, the following is MHO!
CF Moto = Honda clone = 244cc
Linhai = Yamaha clone = 257cc

Is one better that the other, not really, they're a little different is all. Kinda like: Nissan Stansa vs Toyota Corolla. These engines were built to complete with each other.

We happen to have a guru on both here by the name of JR (one of the many here) who owns one of each and will be chiming in shortly I'm sure. Listen to his words of wisdom as they come from years and miles of experience.

Look forward to reading some of your reviews of whatever you decide to ride.

Again, welcome to the crew.

M/C

[Bashan]

Glad to have you on board with the Scooter Doc family. The 250 guys should be able to give you all the info you need to make a decision. Even though I'm mainly a 150cc guy I've worked on a CF Moto 250cc clone and the quality was excellant. I also own a Qlink Pegasus which is really a CF Moto and it's built like a tank, very solid. As you mentioned, the Chinese scooter industry can be tricky to negotiate, you think you've bought a particular scooter and they send you whatever the hell they've got laying around. Reputable dealers won't do that and the banner vendors we have at the top of the site are very honest folks. Well good hunting, Rich

[grocerygetter]

Thanks guys - good food to keep me going on this trek.

I am honestly blown away at the size and following of this industry - had no idea.

I have a couple of guys at work waiting for me to make a decision so they can ride my coat tails and make a purchase with me - internent is our pre-determined route since no Chinese dealers in the area. Dealer selection is going to be key for us.
Rest of the donkeys at work are laughing, can't picture me dropping 9 cylinders to drive to work....told them "I lead - you will follow next year at $5/g" when the scoots are at a premium price.

I'm sure I'll have a few more questions before purchase, and plenty after.
Searching is actually kind of fun

thanks again
Ron

[mthomas]

Welcome aboard Ron,
Nice to have another wrench at our disposal and to add to the wealth of information. I think being a wrench will make your decision easier as you will be able to do your own PDI making sure everything is right. Once you zone in on a model, all you have to worry about is price and not all the other noise that acompanies it.

I agree with the huge following. I think this is for a couple of reasons. Sino scoots require maintenance so they are not for the average Joe that wants to jump on and ride without doing any work. Also, the price is a huge factor in purchasing one of these. I bought mine for $375 and it is a 250 and other guys have paid less than that. The design is simple and straightforward and in most cases, they are easy to fix. In my case, the PO let it sit and the carb gummed up and it would not start. He then proceeded to kill the starter and battery trying to get it to start, easy fix for me. You will find tons of friendly people on here and even a few females that can use a ratchet.

Keep us posted on your decision and let us know if we can help.

[grocerygetter]

Where did you get those saddle bags?
Did you have them painted?
www.amazon.com/Black-Motorcycle-Scooter-Saddlebags-Hard/dp/B001HY7ZQA

I saw heated grips in an accessory site - anyone have them? Can the charging system typically handle add-ons such as heated grips?

Are there any scooters that utilize heat from the rad to be diverted to the passenger via vents or ducting? Just thinking of getting more time out of the wonderful Green Mountain weather, with an average of 58 sunny days/yr, 208 cloudy days/yr (not sure what the remainding days are...)

[grocerygetter]

Hi mthomas --- I'm right with you on the easy-fix / buy cheap arena.

(man you guys are gonna get tired of my long stories..
I just bought my daughter a 2001 Saturn L200 for college because it wasn't running properly as well as a few other little minor-to-me issues.
10 yr old car with only 64k on it and ownership checked out.
Being owned by a lady in Burlington (city driving) originally, then a single mom (I have never vacuumed so many candies and Barbie appendages out of a back seat crack), the maintenance schedule was probably pretty much when something doesn't work - no offence to anyone on that.

When it gets to a point where diagnosis is necessary, its too much $$ for non-wrenchers to justify; that's when I step in with my empty wallet for purchase price, then my trusty scanner / live reader comes out to remedy which sensor is not happy, replace, add a can of Seafoam to the tank & insert 2' long nozzle of Seafoam spray can into manifold and walla. 27mpg around town, 33hwy for $2500.
One of the issues noted at sale was lack of heat. A test drive with my live reader showed ETC reading no more than 149F. Thermostat. Albeit the most expensive one I've ever bought and hard to get at, but $25 for me + time, over $100 at a shop not including "diagnosis".
Sorry for those that can't perform simple repairs.

I guess my main concerns are buying something that isn't prone to extra maintenance - time just isn't there for another gas powered unit for me; and the biggest to me is catastrophic failure that is beyond my control - I'll maintain better than most, and pickup on signals when something is needing attention, but bad block or head castings or cheap metals is what i'm concerned with.
I manage design-for-manufacturing with designers in our Europe and Shanghai offices, and including a trip to Japan, have come to understand Asian manufacturing mentallity more over the yrs. Our molds in US are made to last, Shanghai cannot be manufactured to the same standards - they don't want it, litterally throwing them away in less than a yr because of product changes, so it's difficult to put quality - good steel & design - into throwaway casting molds and short time leads. Enough said.


I can't touch these units - no dealers around. I'm like a blind man shopping for a TV.
So I guess I'm looking for high mileage exeprience with nothing more than normal maintenance - want to weed out the really obvious failure prone models.

thanks again
Ron

[grocerygetter]

Bashan --- EVO sales has added this statement probably because they were getting complaints regarding not receiving the ordered unit.
The "details" are something I pay close attention to - so I'd be upset too if I got the one with the instrument cluster that sucks;
--------------
NOTE on 250cc Touring Scooter manufacturer and brand:
Due to the overwhelming demand for this scooter model and low inventory levels, we are temporarily shipping this model from 3 manufacturers : PEACE, ROKETA or TANK. Orders are filled with either of these brands depending on what is available. The body, quality and specifications of the scooters are the same, only the manufacturer's name, accessories and a few cosmetic details may be different.

[Cruiser]

Welcome to Scooter Doc, Ron. Lots of good info coming at you so far.

Here's a picture of one of my scoots:



It's a Jonway YY250T. There is also a YY250T2 which has the 244cc CfMoto or Honda Helix clone engine like mine. The parts on these engines are interchangeable so they are easy to get and reasonably priced. The quality of the Linhai and CfMoto engines is similar and I haven't heard of any particular weaknesses in either engine.

Maintenance is less time consuming with the 244cc. Valve adjustments and sparkplug replacement is through a removable panel in the bottom of the underseat storage bucket. Valve adjustment usually takes less than 10 minutes and can be done as needed (no more than the Linhai). The CVT cover is held on by 2 bolts and can be removed and replaced in a couple of minutes.

Maintenance on the rest of the scoot would be the same for the Linhai and Cfmoto as the body and frame are a clone of the Honda Reflex for both of them. Check out the Library section to see what's involved in maintaining and tuning each type of scoot.

[LUKE]

Welcome supermarketgetter!!!...the only chinese scoot i love is the Linhai Aeolus 300/or the linhai mainstreet 300. i'm so in love with that scooty,i believe it has the Yamaha engine and the rest of the parts are from mainland.(grrr!) i like the looks,it's low and fat...it's rated 300 cc.

www.buyatvscheap.com/product-p/li300.htm

[grocerygetter]

Great info again Cruiser - I think I'm getting a soft spot for the CfMoto. I like engineering that considers maintenance.

SO - the big hurdle now - how to make sure I get what I order, and from who would be the best.
I'll search for dealer experience on here, I've already ran a few companies thru BBB.
Too bad we can't run a dealer poll based on experience...guess that would be subject to too many variables.

Thanks for your time, appreciate it.

[grocerygetter]

Hey Cruiser - please pass-off my ignorance, but do they still sell your model? I can't find any dealers. I happen to like you instrument cluster better than the Roketa.
Man this is quite the game. Bikes that look identical from different manufacturers with different engines and different instrument clusters.

[Cruiser]

I found three models from three dealers on a google at the top of the list. I know what to look for, so I can find them pretty easy. Here's one:

www.saferwholesale.com/250cc-Scout-4-Stroke-Moped-p/250%20scout%20moped.htm

Here's another:

evosales.com/pd-250cc-scooter-moped.cfm

And a 250B which has the Linhai engine:

www.extreme-scooters.com/roketaMC54-250cc.htm

You will notice that the body and dash is identical to the first two scoots. The only difference is the engine and the price which is $1775 shipped anywhere in the USA.

These links are random searches and are not an endorsement for these vendors.

[grocerygetter]

Awesome - thanks. I'll add them to my spreadsheet and put under the microscope tomorrow.

I'm being beckoned to get my butt in bed but can't stop clicking!!! Getting closer to "SEND PAYMENT"

Ok - I also came across this - any info on this scoot? I could have sworn this same unit is at least $500 more on 90% of the other net stores - something I'm missing with this one?
www.extreme-scooters.com/tank-touring-DE-260.htm

[Cruiser]

This scoot is similar to the VOG 260 which is a very nice scoot. I like the rear shock layout. The price is great too. There have been some negative reviews on this scoot in the past:

www.motor-scooters-guide.com/tank-sports-250-touring-scooter-review.html

They are still being sold under other brands with maybe better quality control. Doing a thorough PDI is the key to having a dependable scoot and avoiding problems down the road. This is true of all Chinese scoots.