Scooter won't start help! By delta9 (Read 1,035 times)

[delta9]

Just picked up a 2007 lance 150cc from a garage sale. Had a broken kill switch. I ordered the new part and installed it today. Still won't start. Starter doesn't turn on. I found the starter relay, and unplugged the connector and shorted the two wires and still doesn't start. I shorted the two positive battery wires on top and the starter turns over but scooter won't run. I think this would indicate the starter relay is bad. 

It seems to be an ac system. The cdi is about twice the size as my dc scooter. I was thinking maybe that was bad or even the coil. I haven't checked for spark yet. Will the spare coil I have for my dc scooter work with the ac bike? I know the cdi isn't compatible. 

[delta9]

Tested spark and it's good. Here's a video trying to start it. It almost wants to start but won't.

[Alleyoop]

If you have spark then the STATOR,PICKUP COIL,CDI and COIL are fine.

It appears it is not getting gas so check FIRST if gas is reaching the carb.
Take the FUEL HOSE off the carb and put it in a CUP and crank it, if fuel comes out then that is eliminated. And now the problem is probably with the carb.
So if it was sitting for months without starting then the PILOT JET and passage are probably clogged with varnish and you will have to take the carb off and clean the JETS and make sure the FUEL OUTLETS by the BUTTERFLY are clear. To clear them get a can of CARB CLEANER they come with a long thin straw that you can stick into the PILOT JET and spray into the PILOT JET and it will clear the passage so that fuel can come out by the BUTTERFLY.

To verify if it is fuel you can take the VACUUM HOSE going to the PETCOCK and pour a teaspoon of gas down directly into the intake and plut the hose back on and it should fire at least once.
Alleyoop

HERE IS MY FULL WRITE UP ON FUEL DELIVERY:
scooterdoc.proboards.com/thread/7723/check-fuel-delivery

IN ADDITION, it also may be that your valves need to be adjusted. If they are tight that will cause them not to seal and the motor will not have enough compression to start and or make it hard to start. So also adjust your valves BOTH to .004 inchs and I think with that and fuel checked it will run for you.

[delta9]

Previous owner replaced carb but never got it started. That rules out carb problems. I was the first one to add fuel to the tank. There is fuel in the fuel filter. I pulled off intake boot and sprayed starting fluid in the carb. No change. Can't be fuel. Replaced spark plug with known good plug and tested spark. It's good too.

I took off crankcase breather hose and cranked engine. A bunch of white smoke was coming out of the port. My other scooter does not do this. Did not smell like oil. Smelled like starting fluid and gas. I'm thinking whatever is causing the breather to pump out smoke is the reason it won't start. What do you make of that?

[delta9]

When I brought the scooter home I did lay it on it's side for 5 minutes in the back of my car if that matters

[Alleyoop]

Just because it is a new carb does not rule it out. Have you checked the FUEL RATIO MIXTURE screw and find out where it is set at? Do this to have a chance Turn the Fuel Ratio Mixture screw clockwise until it stops and then TURN IT COUNTER CLOCKWISE 2 turns.

BUT BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING ELSE since you layed it on its side gas got into the crankcase and that is what your seening with the white smoke or mist. I suggest you change the OIL RIGHT AWAY before the motor really gets ruined without enough lubrication. Then Adjust the Valves like I said set them both to .004 inchs.
Alleyoop

[Alleyoop]

Aug 26, 2015 14:49:22 GMT -6 delta9 said:

Just picked up a 2007 lance 150cc from a garage sale. Had a broken kill switch. I ordered the new part and installed it today. Still won't start. Starter doesn't turn on. I found the starter relay, and unplugged the connector and shorted the two wires and still doesn't start. I shorted the two positive battery wires on top and the starter turns over but scooter won't run. I think this would indicate the starter relay is bad. 

It seems to be an ac system. The cdi is about twice the size as my dc scooter. I was thinking maybe that was bad or even the coil. I haven't checked for spark yet. Will the spare coil I have for my dc scooter work with the ac bike? I know the cdi isn't compatible. 

Just so you know how the Solenoid works and what each wire does.
1. The RED THICK wire from the positive post of the battery goes to ONE terminal on the SOLENOID.
2. The Black wire on the NEGATIVE POST of the battery goes to the FRAME AS GROUND.
3. The Other post on the SOLENOID goes to the STARTER.
4. The RED/YELLOW wire on the pigtail goes to the START BUTTON.
5. The GREEN/YELLOW wire on the pigtail goes to the BRAKE SWITCH.

Here is how the ELECTRIC START works:
When you squeeze the BRAKES(either one) it sends voltage to TWO THINGS (1). to the brake lights and (2) to the Solenoid.
Then when you Press the Start Button is GROUNDS the Solenoid and activates it from the inside and SENDS 12VOLTS from the battery to the Starter. Inside, the Solenoid works just the same as if you TOUCHED BOTH SOLENOID TERMINALS to jump it.

So to see if its the SOLENOID test SQUEEZE the Brake an test the GREEN/YELLOW wire for voltage. Then test for CONTINUITY when pressing the START BUTTON. Usually when the Solenoid goes bad you will hear a CLICKING SOUND coming from it if voltage is being sent and it is being grounded by the start button. Then to Verify that the SOLENOID is INDEED bad you jump the two terminals on the SOLENOID and if it spins your starter Your Solenoid is bad.


HERE IS THE SOLENOID:

[delta9]

Ok. Checked valve clearance and it is fine. .004 on intake and .005 on exhaust. Shot starting fluid down intake vacuum line and still won't start. No change. It just made the smoke coming out of the crankcase breather smell like starter fluid. I think rings/piston are bad. There is a tapping sound coming from the case. There's enough smoke coming out of the breather port that it looks like an exhaust pipe.

Brake lights come on when pulling brake. I checked into it more and it is a dc scooter. Headlight turns on when key is on and engine is off.

Frame model is zn150t-10
Engine code bn157qmj
10" wheels

I think I should just do an engine swap since I do not know the history on the motor. I see one on ebay for $280 with model 1p57qmj. Will this work and is it same quality and power as the bn157qmj?

[Alleyoop]

Just because the headlights come on with the key on does not make it a DC system. Take my Trike it is a AC system and all my lights work off a switch on my right handgrip. The only thing the R/R is doing on mine is charging my battery but the CDI is AC.

So to find out if yours is AC or DC TURN the KEY ON and test the BOTTOM WIRE on the 2 PLUG of the CDI. If with the KEY ON it registers 12volts then it has a DC CDI, if it doesn't then it has an AC CDI.
When folks mention if DC OR AC all that means is what does your scooter have a DC CDI or AC CDI. If DC then the motor will NOT RUN WITH OUT A GOOD BATTERY. If the battery gets weak or bad the motor will not run.
But if AC then the CDI is being powered by the STATOR and you can actually take the battery out and kickstart it and the motor will run. Or start it and disconnect the battery and the motor will keep on running.

Also I WOULD NOT GET A BN or 1P motor some have different parts that are not so common. Some have longer cam chains and rockers. Also stay away from motors with only TWO VALVE COVER BOLTS parts for those are hard to fine.

I would just get you common 157QMJ parts for those are everywhere and not expensive and performance parts are everywhere.

I have the 157QMJ and I had it bored and a 62bbk and a Stroker Crank and it is now a 182cc motor from 149.6. Runs like a raped ape had it since 2009 and you can go into my garage turn the key on and hit the start button and it fires right up you can do this 24/7 365 days a year.
Alleyoop

[jct842]

The way that engine sounds in video I think it would fire with a squirt of ether in the carb intake. Lots of people don't like ether but it does work. Ether today is not like it used to be and not nearly as good but it does work.