Clinician
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Post by hunter on Mar 19, 2014 16:54:21 GMT -6
It was suggested that I put my questions on a thread for all to, uh, enjoy. Went from a spark problem to a no fuel or proper vacuum problem in short order. I know next to nothing about scooter carbs or the fuel path in the carb so this should be interesting. I used a car vacuum gauge at the manifold and got a reading but don't know if it's accurate, car gauge you know. I located what is called a vacuum pump and sucked on the vacuum side and got a good flow from the line to the carb, that's good, right? But hook it up and the engine vacuum only produces a trickle, at best. On top I have what is called a CV thing that has a vacuum line an operates a diaphragm that operates a slider that has a needle to plug up a jet type thing. The slider works by pushing it up with my finger but not by vacuum, guess that means a bad diaphragm? The diaphragm looks a little odd but since it is not flat?? the slider is the center of it.?? Anyway, what part of this has a thing to do with no fuel in the carb? The bowl is dry as toast but the float stuff all works, not plugged or anything. I vote for the vacuum problem, but I don't know why. Hope I didn't get to technical on you all,HEE HEE, but any ideas? Help is on the way, right? Thanks to all.
PS. The float bowl looks like it NEVER had fuel in it. NO residue, no nothing, looks like it came out of a box that was mailed to me. The drain nipple screw was tight and nothing leaked when I filled the bowl.
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Post by Bashan on Mar 20, 2014 12:49:20 GMT -6
First of all Stan, if you want to clean your carb use this link to the Big Guy's infamous video. Secondly, does your system look like this?:
Or is that fuel valve hanging off of the bottom of the tank in the form of a petcock? I know we've talked about this but let's all get on the same page. |
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Post by Alleyoop on Mar 20, 2014 13:16:06 GMT -6
Ok First thing is Take Pictures of the CARB area Both sides showing the hoses going and coming. You may have something hooked up wrong and the only way to tell is with pictures. As you know pictures are worth a thousand words. Otherwise we could be beating a horse to death when it is something simple. If gas flows out of the fuel hose from the Petcock when vacuum is applied and it flows to the carb that is good. Now pictures of the carb area and the hoses by the carb area and intake manifold come into play. Do not worry about the slider barrel inside the Venturi that comes into play after the motor is running and you give it throttle. The air pressure lifts the barrel to pull the needle out of the main jet according to the amount of air being let in. It may be that the motor is not creating enough suction, have you adjusted the valves? If the valves are tight they are not sealing and if so the motor is loosing compression and not enough vacuum. BUT first thing is a look at how you have everything connected. Just so you know I INVENTED THE CARBS  Alleyoop |
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Clinician
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Post by hunter on Mar 20, 2014 18:23:52 GMT -6
First, to bashan, my stuff is kind of like that and yes the fuel valve is on the tank, no air cut off. To alleyoop, I have the carb off and all lines off. Before I did that I checked for vacuum at the manifold, but I used a car gauge. It showed action but not enough to move any fuel. sucking on the fuel valve line got good flow in fuel line to carb but when lines are connected flow is bad. The carb it self is supper clean, looks like it came out of the box, not off the engine. I have an adapter fitting for my compression gauge ordered so I haven't done a test yet. The old fashion way won't work, my finger is too small to plug the hole. I got some but?? I must have bad vacuum somehow and the valves used to be ok not long ago. So? I'd like to start over on the TDC since I did fool with the flywheel and key way, just to replace stator. I don't know why the bowl is soo clean no residue and the float passes a short test. The compression test will tell lots more, have I missed anything? Well, of course I have, sorry. Thanks for chipping in.
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Post by Bashan on Mar 20, 2014 19:15:00 GMT -6
Do you have a hose to the right side of the carb? If so that's the air cut. Set the valves as Alley suggested, it can affect the vacuum as we discussed. I use .004" intake and .005". I don't know what Alley uses. If you have enough compression to pop your finger and the valves are right you will have enough vacuum. It simply opens a valve, the vacuum does not move or pump fuel unless you have a fuel pump, you do not. We need photos Stan. If you need help with that let me know. Rich
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Post by Alleyoop on Mar 20, 2014 19:36:06 GMT -6
Hey Bud, I will ask again TAKE PICTURES OF YOUR CARB AND HOSES otherwise we are just guessing at what you really have. Forget about the Vacuum gauge listen to what we ask for so we can help otherwise everyone is just guessing.
Also if you messed with the stator even if you took it off and put it back on with the woodruff key THAT would not change your timing. To change your timing you would have to take the Chain off the CAM and then move the crank from its current position.
In a NUTSHELL forget about all the timing and stuff and SHOW PICTURES otherwise we cannot help you.
Alleyoop
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Post by Bashan on Mar 21, 2014 13:27:01 GMT -6
Epiphany.....epiphany! Stan, replace your fuel lines with clear tubing. You should be able to get some at Auto Weinie. It has to be fuel line though. That way we might be able to see what's going on. Rich
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Post by Bashan on Mar 21, 2014 14:27:18 GMT -6
Just so you know I INVENTED THE CARBS Alleyoop  |
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Post by Alleyoop on Mar 21, 2014 14:29:49 GMT -6
AND HERE IS HOW TO CORRECTLY AND PROPERLY ADJUST YOUR CARB: .......................................................  THEN AFTER YOU HAVE ADJUSTED YOUR CARB YOU GET THIS: ....................................................... |
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Doc's Anything Goes
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Post by tvnacman on Mar 21, 2014 16:17:25 GMT -6
love that carb adjustment video
John
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Post by Bashan on Mar 21, 2014 21:51:05 GMT -6
Great videos Alley, very informative.  John, will you quit sending me pictures of your specials? I already have six of these and they just slow the scooter down, it forgets where it's at, and then it's hungry. 
Bet he has to clean that puppy a lot. Stan, just look away my friend...look away...These people are distorted.
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Post by Alleyoop on Mar 22, 2014 12:35:49 GMT -6
Hey Bud, I will ask again TAKE PICTURES OF YOUR CARB AND HOSES otherwise we are just guessing at what you really have. Forget about the Vacuum gauge listen to what we ask for so we can help otherwise everyone is just guessing. Also if you messed with the stator even if you took it off and put it back on with the woodruff key THAT would not change your timing. To change your timing you would have to take the Chain off the CAM and then move the crank from its current position. In a NUTSHELL forget about all the timing and stuff and SHOW PICTURES otherwise we cannot help you. Alleyoop Ok waiting on Hunter, back to the OP's problem. Hunter are you going to get some pictures for us or not? Alleyoop |
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Post by hunter on Mar 22, 2014 12:58:24 GMT -6
I'm willing to help and I know you all are willing but I'm stuck on the pic request. I have the carb all the lines the manifold all off the scoot and on the work bench. Yes Rich, I have the room. So, what should I take a pic of? Should I put it all back together the way it was and send that pic? I didn't think the empty space where the carb and lines used to be would help much, maybe I'm wrong, huh? I've been batting zero so far. Let me know, I'll take a pic of whatever will help, I'll just need a little time if I have to put everything back. The only thing I know seems wrong is the action of the vacuum valve under the tank. Sucking lightly on the vacuum hose lets good flow through the fuel line to the carb. Hooking the hose to the manifold and cranking the engine produces only a trickle of fuel out the fuel line to the carb. That's why low vacuum came to mind. That could lead to internal things that should be identified by a compression test. I'm more then willing to send along any info you guys need, I'm just not sure about what's going to be required since I have all the stuff apart. Kind of like, send us pics and I ask, "pictures of what" everythings gone. Thanks, get back to me and set my dumb a.. straight.
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Post by Alleyoop on Mar 22, 2014 13:09:15 GMT -6
What appears from what you are saying weak Vacumm it then is not your carb right now. So put everything back as normal then take a few pictures of the hoses from the tank going to the carb as well as the carb area hooked up to the INTAKE MANIFOLD.
Then we can work on the low suction problem WHICH is either VALVES are not sealing or RINGS are shot creating no compression.
Alleyoop
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Post by hunter on Mar 22, 2014 15:24:08 GMT -6
I'm willing to help and I know you all are willing but I'm stuck on the pic request. I have the carb all the lines the manifold all off the scoot and on the work bench. Yes Rich, I have the room. So, what should I take a pic of? Should I put it all back together the way it was and send that pic? I didn't think the empty space where the carb and lines used to be would help much, maybe I'm wrong, huh? I've been batting zero so far. Let me know, I'll take a pic of whatever will help, I'll just need a little time if I have to put everything back. The only thing I know seems wrong is the action of the vacuum valve under the tank. Sucking lightly on the vacuum hose lets good flow through the fuel line to the carb. Hooking the hose to the manifold and cranking the engine produces only a trickle of fuel out the fuel line to the carb. That's why low vacuum came to mind. That could lead to internal things that should be identified by a compression test. I'm more then willing to send along any info you guys need, I'm just not sure about what's going to be required since I have all the stuff apart. Kind of like, send us pics and I ask, "pictures of what" everythings gone. Thanks, get back to me and set my dumb a.. straight.
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..BAD TO THE BONE..
John, will you quit sending me pictures of your specials? I already have six of these and they just slow the scooter down, it forgets where it's at, and then it's hungry. 