Ugh, Need help with a couple things By Jeff (Read 1,816 times)

[Jeff]

Doing some maintenance on my Vog and have 2 concerns.

First, I'm replacing the fuel lines and filter. It had 2 filters, one between the tank and the pump, and another between the pump and carb. Both were installed backwards, no surprise. I eliminated the second one and bought a bigger, better one for between the tank and pump but it's not going to fit in the space where the old one was, which is between the tank and the plastic shield under the scoot. Just too big for that cramped space.

So the question is... does this filter need to be installed that low. Can't I run a longer fuel line from the tank up into the engine compartment, through a filter, and back down to the fuel pump? The pump is vacuum operated so shouldn't need to be right there at the bottom of the tank, as in gravity feed, right?
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Second - I wanted to remove the variator to clean out the abundance of grease inside the variator cover. It was so much it was leaking out of the variator cover, which had a crappy gasket that couldn't hold anything in. Need to check and clean the rollers too. I made a variator tool, but in trying to remove the variator nut, I broke one of the 2 holes in the variator. I have an impact gun but I made the tool and attempted to NOT use the impact gun for removing the variator because I wanted to reassembly the variator without the impact gun, since it's an air impact, not electric. I wanted to properly torque the nut back on.

What the heck. Can I just keep using the variator front piece as is? It won't be properly balanced with the small bolt hole part broken off (it is a very small piece). Can that be purchased separately?

I think I'll fire up the air impact and take the nut off, but don't want to use it for re-assembly.

Also that nut is standard right-hand thread, right? Counter-clockwise to remove it, right?

[Alleyoop]

The Fuel Filter can be either between the Pump and Carb or Pump and Tank doesn't matter. What you want is a Filter to trap any small particles either coming from inside the hoses or from the tank. I prefer the Fuel Filter about 1 foot from the Carb also makes it easier to change out rather than have to take panels off to just get to the Fuel Filter. You only need one Fuel Filter. Now if your tank is ABOVE the Carb you have a PETCOCK which is a Gravity Feed system and in this caseyou do NOT want the fuel line or Filter Below the Carb.
If the Tank is BELOW the Carb then you have a Fuel Pump it actually pumps the fuel up to your carb so it does not matter where the fuel filter is.

Now as far as your Variator I just use an Electric Impact Wrench to take it off and put on. Using the other tools to hook onto the two holes and what not crap like what happened to yours can happen if something slips or the tool does not fit properly in the two holes on the Variator fan.

The Nut goes on and off as normal Counter Clockwise to Lossen and Clockwise to Tighten.
Putting it on I first put the Variator back on then scarew on the Nut with my hands as tight as I can get it then I hit it with 3-1 second bursts with the Impact wrench and It has never come loose on me.
You can run with it the way it is if it is a small piece that came off, until you get another one to replace it.
Alleyoop

[Cruiser]

Welcome to Scooter Doc, Jeff. Like Alley says, one fuel filter should be enough. I prefer the filter to be between the fuel pump and the tank because there are rubber components including a diaphragm in the fuel pump which should be protected from foreign particles. The fuel line between the tank and pump should not loop up too much above the inlet of the fuel pump in order to prevent an air lock if the tank ever runs out of gas. The vacuum fuel pump is not a good suction pump and likes to have a straight run from the bottom of the tank and be mounted below the outlet of the tank.

I have chipped variator fans in the past and I try to avoid using them. The fan spins at a very high speed and an imbalance condition might stress the crank bearings. Here's a link for a variator fan:

www.partsforchinesescooters.com/asp/gmi/?choice=showCategory&category=1394&classid=139405

I am also uncomfortable with putting an unspecified amount of torque on the end of the crankshaft when installing the variator, so I always use a torque wrench. I use a heavy duty strap wrench from Sears to hold the variator. It also works great on the clutch.

Don't be shy. How about introducing yourself in the new members section. Maybe a picture or two of your scoot?

[Jeff]

Thanks for the quick replies, and here are this morning's thoughts. While I would prefer the fuel to be filtered before entering the pump, I think I will keep the larger filter I bought and install it a foot from the carb as alleyoop has done. This is something I considered doing right off anyway, and it does make it easy to check and change out in the future if needed.

Regarding the variator, I used a 1/2" drive with a 18" breaker bar on that nut and could not loosen it. The tool I made using 1/8" bar stock bent badly, needs to be 1/4". Even with the tool bending though, it held the variator stationary until the bolt hole broke. The tool uses M8 x 30mm bolts, largest I could get to fit in the holes, and I didn't shock anything by jerking the breaker bar, just a slow smooth pulling on the breaker bar. I'm surprised the bolt hole broke, and equally surprised that nut never gave. I'm actually concerned that an impact wrench might snap the crankshaft.

Well I have to go to Sears today to get an impact quality socket and maybe I'll get a chain wrench as well. Once the fan is off I'll look for possible additional damage around the bolt hole. If it looks ok I may run it until I get another fan. Cruiser, thanks for the link.

Just so you guys know, I've hanging out in this forum for a long time and am a member over at the dawg site as well. Appreciate your help and comments. I'll see if I can post some pics today.

[speedracer]

Hey Jeff, my 250 is in the process of being replaced with a new one. Mine has been trouble from the beginning. I do use an electric impact wrench and it works fine. What I finally noticed after removing the fan blade 5 or 6 times so far is that there are two broken fan blades. Not snapped off but the ends missing. I never noticed this before. I believe the fan went on from the factory broken as there are not pieces of metal inside the CVT cover. I also feel it caused all of my problems inside the variator. Broken U slides which in turn did damage to the roller weight cover, and a boss which looks like a WW II relic.

If I were you, I'd order a new fan cover ASAP. So far I don't feel there has been any damage to the crankshaft. Been running it a few times this week in the garage without the variator and the engine is smooth running and all looks good.

[Jeff]

Dug out my old air impact wrench that I haven't seen in a dozen years and found it has a part missing, regulator I think. So Harbor Freight has a 25% off sale today and I picked up their best electric impact wrench. It wouldn't budge the nut, not one bit. I had also bought the strap wrench from Sears so I gave that a try using my breaker bar and I snapped the strap. I don't think this nut is coming off. I may fix the air impact wrench and use it but I'll probably snap the crankshaft.

[Alleyoop]

You might try a little heat on the Nut, it probably has LockTite on it. So Put a little heat to it and then hit it with the Impact Wrench(Counter Clockwise of course).
Alleyoop

[Jeff]

The Vog on a new acquired lift.

Attachments:

[Jeff]

Variator from hell

Attachments:

[Cruiser]

At least you should be able to get your money back on the strap wrench if you got this one:

[zugzug]

going by the marks on the nut you've been trying to turn it the wrong way. Try counterclockwise with the impact wrench and it will probably work

[Jeff]

Cruiser, yes that's the one I got and will be returning.

zugzug, I am starting to think this is a reverse thread too. Has no one else seen a reverse thread on the Linhai engine? Yamaha service manual doesn't state one way or the other, I would think it would state that this is a reverse thread if it was. I'm paranoid to touch it anymore.

[speedracer]

I'm with Alley on this one. Use a torch and heat up that nut then hit with the impact wrench. That nut was put on with china locktight which is hard to loosen. As far as I know it is not a reverse thread.

[damin69]

Nope leffy Loosy. I have basically the same scooter with the MC-62-250. I use an Air Impact to get the Variator Nut off.

[Jeff]

I tried the electric impact with the clutch bell and it won't budge either. So I can try heat, liquid wrench, or use a dremel to cut the nuts off. I'll try some heat first but may not get to it for a couple of days I doubt liquid wrench would do anything for locktight. I could strangle the meathead at the factory who must have used red locktight on both nuts. I may look into fixing the air imact too but I bet it will still need heat. <sigh>