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Post by olivertwisted on Mar 8, 2016 0:24:48 GMT -6
So, I did flip the connectors , inside their own slots.
I get nothing at all either way when pressing the start switch, UNTIL I add a frame ground to the G/W on the start switch.
So then, I get:
KILL on STOP= Solenoid and Spark
KILL on RUN = Solenoid, no spark.
I'm gonna stare at my notes, and a pic of the switch for a while and see if I can't make my head spin faster! LOL!.
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Post by olivertwisted on Mar 7, 2016 23:13:29 GMT -6
YES to your question. The only thing is WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO KILL THE MOTOR. So I would steady the switch OPENED up and with a diagram of the wires as if plugged in or plugged in if you can do that with the switch open and SEE which contacts get touched when moving the switch to RUN and NOT RUN. Since you said the KILLWIRE you plugged back into the CDI and it sparks when it is in the OFF position. maybe the plugs are just backwards and in NOT RUN position the contacts are touching the g/w and ground. So maybe just turn the pluggs around in the same slot.  Sorry, I'm a bit confused because the notations suggest to "flip" the plug at the upper right in the pic, so that the G/W is on the side where the arrow points. To understand, do you mean to move the pins? Because, the G/W will be further from that slot if I flip it. If nothing bad could happen then, I could just try it and make a wish though! Unfortunately, I'm doubting that I have the intuitiveness to even make sense of things when I DO open the switch . I'm hunting the net for diagram that I can understand and follow to no avail, so far. Even better, a PIC of a switch and wires that are the colors of mine. YEAH, like "painting by numbers", THAT'S what I need! LOL! |
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Post by olivertwisted on Mar 7, 2016 22:54:12 GMT -6
Well , after a few days of hospitals and DRs for my Mother, it's kinda good to be back to this problem, ha! She's doing a bit better for now  Alleyoop Here's what I get with a solenoid/spark check, CDI plugged in. With the start switch wired STOCK: KILL on STOP= I get Spark and solenoid KILL on RUN= NO solenoid so, no spark. ( At that above, I get what you mean, it's operating opposite the way it should except, as I understand it, it should also turn over on KILL/STOP but not spark) If I ADD a frame ground to the start switch ground and I get: KILL on STOP= I get Spark and solenoid BUT THIS happened before and I thought it was just my rickety connection of the frame ground jumped onto the start switch ground, the spark is INTERMITTENT. KILL on RUN = Solenoid- YES, Spark-NO.  |
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Post by olivertwisted on Mar 1, 2016 17:41:55 GMT -6
HAHA, yes, I'm sure that you ARE looking at wires and switches, aaaaall night long !
Yes. I just checked for spark again to confirm. I plugged the entire CDI in, Still spark with killswitch on 'Kill" but NO spark on "Run".
It makes sense even to me (Lol, whaaaat?!) that it is a ground problem, by now. I had the toggle still rigged up from last night with its own frame ground and it works. When I have the actual new start switch on there, it wont work UNLESS I touch the separate frame ground to it too.
So, to your comment :
"One way to make the PUSH START BUTTON work is to GROUND the GREEN/WHITE wire since for some reason moveing the killswitch to run is NOT making contact with the green/white and ground even if you manually ground the green wire? "
If I manually ground the the G/W on EITHER wire on the START push button, it does activate solenoid.
ALSO, if I manually ground the G/W wire at the KILLSWITCH and use the new START button, it activates the Solenoid.
Thank you YES, SEEING something is MUCH easier for me to comprehend . I will take that advice to study the contacts and draw it out on paper while I do, to take my mind through the steps. That IS kind of what I was able to do last night in my mind (A tiny breakthrough) which led me to revisit the/your idea that the pins may be misaligned. But definitely, I learn better, visually. Point, well taken!
To your #2 comment, although I don't know enough to have the big picture of what will cause what, lol, I was searching last night for info on the key switch to test it and to help me understand any results.
I am still working my way through this thread to re-test this and that, to glean clues and understanding. Also, yours and "Bashans" tutorials and PDFs that I find here on the forum.
So, about your comment :
"One way to make the PUSH START BUTTON work is to GROUND the GREEN/WHITE wire since for some reason moveing the killswitch to run is NOT making contact with the green/white and ground even if you manually ground the green wire?
Doing that will not activate the Solenoid unless you squeeze the brakes and push the start button the only difference is the PUSH BUTTON will always be grounded already killswitch off or on."
Is that to say that grounding that wire could be a possible permanent workaround in the event that I cannot isolate and fix the issue?
And to this:
"The important thing is to get spark when you want it AND the solenoid to activate when you squeeze the brakes and push the start button. If the killswitch is in NO RUN it will turn the motor over but it will not start until you switch the KILLSWITCH TO RUN."
Agreed! Lol! Unfortunately, I'm still only getting spark on the "Kill" position :/
I've got to take care of some serious stuff for my Mother tonight (Bet you could use a rest from this too!, Lol) but I'll check in for any comments as soon as I can. Probably tomorrow.
Thanks , as always!
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Post by olivertwisted on Mar 1, 2016 6:34:26 GMT -6
I’ve been going through this thread from the beginning to re-check things. Anything of note that I found, I’m listing here as a recap 1. When I re-checked for voltage at the G/Y at the solenoid harness, my reading was below 12V’s, I got 10.88v’s or so. I’m not sure if that is an issue? 2. Pertaining to your post #36 : When I ground the G/W wire at the back of the start switch, key on, it activates the solenoid, regardless of which position the KILL switch is in. 3. If I’m getting an understanding of how this circuit works (LOL, RIGHT!), when the kill switch is set to “RUN” the contacts should line up to complete and send ground to the START switch by the G/W wire, yes? If so, shouldn’t the G/W and the GREEN from the connector opposite the G/W be in pins directly across from each other, theoretically? I know, you mentioned that before. I’m just running it by you in my own words to see if I am generally starting to “GET” this. AND I’m starting to wonder if ever before I took the switches out during teardown, if the wire perhaps came out and I just THOUGHT I put it back in right and dismissed it or, something. 4. I was going through the PDF on the KILLSWITCH again too and I get continuity from the killwire at its switch to the CDI HARNESS but do NOT get a reading for GROUND continuity from that harness killwire to the frame, with the killswitch on STOP and the key ON. Since there is a brand new killswitch installed, I doubt it is shorted as the PDF states but wonder if it points us back to bullet point #3 above? Again, perhaps a pin IS in the wrong place ? 5. But GUESS WHAT?! Somehow, we never got around to trying the other toggle switch and I just DID, and it WORKS! So, that G/W wire to the START switch I gather, is not getting good ground to it after all, like you’ve suspected several times! 6. That’s about all I can stand to do right now. It’s 4.30 AM here. I’m eager to hear what you think! 7. Thank you, thank you, thank you again,for SO much help Alley! |
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 22:59:06 GMT -6
Heyyyyyy , what about this alarm system doo doo that's in here? That ties in somewhere to prevent starting on some of these scoots, yes? Though, I never touched the wiring on this during the reconditioning of the bike and, the bike USED TO start up, before the reconditioning. A shot in the dark, I know but, what do I know ?! EDIT: In any case, I searched on it and found your tutorial on disconnecting it, and did so.  |
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 22:23:29 GMT -6
Didnt work. Daggummit!
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 22:21:29 GMT -6
LOL! Ok, Alley. Rest your poor nooodle! I'll try it to see what happens. Thank you !
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 22:17:35 GMT -6
I'm willing. Worst case scenario, it just wont work ?
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 22:11:47 GMT -6
It seems that it isnt the switch because, this has the NEW switches that I got in the mail today yet, the same exact results as the old switches. :/
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 22:03:59 GMT -6
OK now splice a ground on the green wire next to the GREEN/WHITE and see if you have SOLENOID. IF YOU have solenoid then with the KILLSWITCH on RUN see if you have spark. That gets me solenoid at "Kill" but not at "Run" . |
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 21:58:15 GMT -6
I think that you should take all of my pistons for this. LOL!
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 21:53:40 GMT -6
DANG but look at the actual wires see the B/W on the SPIDY is on the outside and the green on the inside. On the new one the B/W was on the inside and the green on the outside that is why I said to flip it. OK maybe the switch is backwards set it back up to kill and you have spark. what happens if you put it on RUN do you still have spark and does it turn the motor over? MY BRAIN IS STARTING TO MELT (HAHA). No. I still get nothing. No solenoid. |
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 21:49:12 GMT -6
Yeah... we weren't gonna be that lucky! Unfortunately, they are sitting in there correctly. It's hatd to tell through the dirt but, I have the thing in front of me to turn it around in my hand and see the spaces. You dont have that luxury Also, in the NEW pic, that wire running to the left is a grey and blue striped wire that isnt connected to it but is one of the ground wires I ran to tap into. Okay, I'll try the above and post back. By the way, about your brain melting.... Mine was mush when we began this. You poor fella, dealin' with ME!! |
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Post by olivertwisted on Feb 29, 2016 21:32:42 GMT -6
If you look at the "Spidery" pic, the G/W and B/W are on opposite ends from each other. Right now, "Flipped" they are on the same end . No bueno
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