Pulling a scooter by the back wheel By robertban (Read 1,969 times)

[robertban]

Just wondering if I was to build a bumper lift for the front wheel of my 250cc (YY250T-2 or MC-13-250) touring scooter weight close to 400#. And if it was to break down how far could it be pull (if Possible) by the back wheel or would the engine be cranking due to the drive belt at a speed of 50mph or less

[Alleyoop]

No, it will be free wheeling, remember it is the PULLEY that actually has the CLUTCH as one assembley and all that will be turning is the BELL and wheel.
Alleyoop

[FACE PLANT FOR LIFE]

The clutch is basically disengaged without the engine itself moving at a certain RPM. You don't have to worry about pulling it, it won't hurt it.

[fugaziiv]

Just remember to pat attention to the speed rating of the rear tire.


Matt

[robertban]

Thank You All
for your great help from the forums I post to
(It Is The Ride, Scooter Professor, Scooter Doc Forum)

[LUKE]

the burden is on the transmission gears because it is turning more rapidly when the backwhee is turned as suppose to when the motor is running and clutch is engaged. just imagine the wear and tear, . gears, oil seal , bearings etc... woooh!!

[jct842]

Jun 28, 2014 4:41:58 GMT -6 LUKE said:

the burden is on the transmission gears because it is turning more rapidly when the backwhee is turned as suppose to when the motor is running and clutch is engaged. just imagine the wear and tear, . gears, oil seal , bearings etc... woooh!!

That makes about as much sense as the rest of lukes rhetoric.

[kz1000st]

Seriously Luke. When the rear wheel spins only the bell housing spins. The clutch only engages when the engine spins and forces out the engagement arms. Since most Chinese 250s are clones of Honda or Yamaha designs I think the hardened steel gears can take a little 65 mph spinning. Well maybe the Honda designs can. The jury is still out on those Yamaha transmissions. You know how much work it takes to keep them going.

[cyborg]

the rear wheel will freewheel spin,,,i'd do it for short hops,,nothing long tho,,,across town,,,maybe 100 miles if even that,,,i wouldn't do it for a vacation type trip where it's several thousand miles,,,not saying that it can't be done ,,but personally i wouldn't do it,,actually luke has the answer with the trailer,,,small ones are available super cheap and and on CL are a gift lightly used

[LUKE]

Jun 28, 2014 7:15:23 GMT -6 kz1000st said:

Seriously Luke. When the rear wheel spins only the bell housing spins. The clutch only engages when the engine spins and forces out the engagement arms. Since most Chinese 250s are clones of Honda or Yamaha designs I think the hardened steel gears can take a little 65 mph spinning. Well maybe the Honda designs can. The jury is still out on those Yamaha transmissions. You know how much work it takes to keep them going.

wow!! gosh, kZ you have to review the BASIC anatomy of your scooter, you noticed i quote your post because you might delete it after discovering that the bell is attached to the central shaft and the central shaft is attached to the gears which is soaked in gear oil ,supported by bearings and oil seal, ... the CvT is totally out of the story. OMG,, you disappoint me each passing day KZ,,, i think i need to re-orient you about scooter parts and how they wotk..



THINK!!!!

[kz1000st]

Seriously? You wouldn't pull a bunch of free spinning gears at speeds they're designed for?

Maybe you missed this on the post I won't ever delete.

The clutch only engages when the engine spins and forces out the engagement arms.

Or did I have to go into more detail. The engine engages the clutch only when the engine is running, the variator rollers move out causing the variator to engage and spin the belt which causes the clutch arms to engage with the bell housing and move the scooter. Without the engine running the axle spins because of the wheel spinning. The axle also has a gear inside, that engages with an intermediate shaft gear that has another gear on it that spins the transmission shaft which the bell housing is on. If the scooter is being towed those gears, made of hardened steel, spin on shafts on ball bearings and yes, spin through oil seals totally designed for the job. Those seals neither know nor care why they're spinning only that there's lubricant that keeps seals, shafts, gears and bearing oiled.

But I should have realized you didn't know that and described it to you since I know more than you do.

Want to know how I know? Because I took a Honda Big Ruckus apart when the transmission shaft bearing failed and got to see the whole inside of a scooter gear box.

[royldoc]

Jun 28, 2014 4:41:58 GMT -6 LUKE said:

the burden is on the transmission gears because it is turning more rapidly when the backwhee is turned as suppose to when the motor is running and clutch is engaged. just imagine the wear and tear, . gears, oil seal , bearings etc... woooh!!

If the scooter is driving at 65mph or being towed at 65mph the gears in the transmission would still turn at the same rpm. the only difference is the input of the trans. has been moved to the output side and the stress on the gears is on the opposite side of the teeth on the gears than normal. It does take more torque to turn the the output shaft because the ratio has been reversed, but no more stress on the gears will be applied. Actually it is probably less due to the fact it is only turning the output shaft that was the input and does not have a load on it since you are not turning the cvt and engine.

Roy

[LUKE]

yes, there is no stress because thrre is less load, BUT the gears are turning more faster and of course if it turns faster, wear and tear will be faster too.

try to open the cvt cover, now turn the wheels youll notice yhe bell turns faster, now do the reverse, turn the bell, the wheel turns slow. these are the thing Kz and cyborg do not know, i need to educate them once in a while. i do it for free tho, so take advantage of my free lecture.. lol

[jct842]

Luke that is impossible.....those gears turn the same speed no matter which direction you spin the wheel.

[royldoc]

Luke, me thinks you are the one that does not know and needs to be edjumicated. So take advantage of my lecture. Let me 'splain it to ya. My stock transmission has a gear ratio of 11.05:1. What this means is, if I turn the input shaft (clutch bell) 11.05 revolutions the output shaft (rear wheel) will turn 1 revolution. Likewise if I turn the rear wheel 1 complete revolution the clutch bell will turn 11.05 revolutions. The gears in the transmission turn at the same speed regardless of which shaft I turn.

My Rear tire has a circumference of 48 inches (4 Feet). What This means is for every revolution of the tire the Scooter moves 4 feet down the road and the clutch bell will have turned 11.05 revolutions. If I push/pull the scooter 4 feet the clutch bell turns 11.05 revolutions. If I turn the clutch bell 11.05 revolutions the scooter moves 4 feet. So how do the gears turn faster? Now lets expand on this. In one mile of travel the rear wheel will have rotated 1320 revolutions regardless of weather the scooter is being pushed/pulled or under power from the engine and the clutch bell will have turned 14,586 revolutions.

Roy