Still not Charging back to round1 By damin69 (Read 13,593 times)

[Cruiser]

Good luck, Todd. I noticed that the regulator you mentioned is a 5 wire and I'm guessing that the black/white wire is a sensor or feedback wire to let the regulator know how much to charge the battery. This would mean that the ground is through the case/heatsink? You did mention about drawing over 17 amps from the regulator given the electrical load of the scoot. This leads to another possible problem since the wires in the scoot are not rated for that much current. I noticed my regulator puts out 14.2 volts at the regulator which ends up being 12.7 volts at the battery. The only thing in the circuit besides the wires is the blocking diode which should drop no more than .7 volts. In my case, I'm loosing .8 volts in the wiring. If I can get a break from the heat, I will replace the blocking diode with a relay and rewire with 12 guage wire. Replacing the fan is also on the list. Have you been able to test out the computer fan setup yet?

[damin69]

The top VRRPM3 is 5 wire. The one I am getting to try out is actually a 8 wire You can read Tony's quote below. This is a picture of the one I am getting to test out.


I looked at it again and I do think the VRRPM3H would be a better choice. Also it looks like all the wire color codes match. This is also the highest amperage unit I carry and should last forever on a scooter...

Since this unit senses voltage off the black wire, it's likely not to have the same problems of the VRRPM3 that sense voltage internally. One thing on this unit for you to be aware of is that the pos and neg out leads are duplicated. You can connect the 2 reds together or only use one for positive (the same for negative on the green wires.)

Tony


I did try out the cooler. It did not help enough I have been checking my voltage at my Reg and at my Batter they are not both the same now that I replaced all the wire that makes up the Charging circuit. I have all of that circuit running on thicker wire and by passed one plug and put in a good inline fuse to replace the one fuse the wires were running through in the crappy fuse box. by doing that my voltage drop was almost completely eliminated between the Reg and the Batt.

Im not sure about the enricher. I have not looked at my Dads Linhai Regulator but I can sure tell you he has 0 problems with charging at all. Plus His manual acutally said that he could replace the headlights with 55/60 watt bulbs with no problem. And he never did have any problems. Heck I was down to pulling one plug of one of my head lights when I was running both halogen headlights he was running both. I was still dropping voltage until it would not start in about 5 hours.

I just thought it was weird that the reg they are sending is rated at only 7 amps but the schematic clearly shows that being overloaded by over 2.5 times overall.

[damin69]

Oh yeah I forgot to mention I had some time on my hands today and stopped by the local Motorcycle/ATV dealer he looked up a Honda RR for me. NEW $265 bucks. But he also said they were rated at around a 15 amp draw for the CF250/CH250 Honda Motors. Im not willing to Shell out that much for an RR.

[Cruiser]

Todd,

It's easy to isolate the enricher from the charging circuit by pulling the bullet connector which is branching off the stator wire. I remember seeing that 7 amp regulator and wondering what they where using it on. The Honda RR's are ridiculously overpriced. I checked out the CfMoto website and checked the RR's for the 250cc Fashion and the V3 which are the same. Using the dealer locater, my local dealer has them in stock for a MSRP of $40. Part number = CF250T-463000. I might give him a call to see if he knows the power ratings on this unit.

UPDATE: The local dealer does not have any in stock. The part number has changed along with the price in the past 24 hours. It appears the dealer links are a work in progress by CfMoto and the info is not 100% accurate. The dealer said he would check on local availability of regulators for me. Have to call him back.

[Cruiser]

This is not an easy nut to crack. The problem I have found is a large drop between the regulator output and the battery. I have measured a 1.5 volt difference between the two points. The blocking diode accounts for about .7 volts while wiring and connector losses account for .8 volts. We are talking about a distance of less than 2 feet. I'm in the process of running 12 guage wire for the output of the regulator. I'm also replacing the blocking diode with a relay which activates only when the engine is running. This relay will also serve double duty as I will use it to activate my electric fuel pump also. I am also replacing the OEM fan which in my case uses about 5 amps with the 3 amp model. On my scoot, it looks like the fan motor can be interchanged on to the OEM shroud. It looks like the YY250T uses 2 different types of cooling fans - the 3 legged style with no real shroud and the full shroud pancake style like mine. Right now the scoot is naked with almost no plastic on it so I'm anxious to see how things will turn out when everything is back together.

The CfMoto regulator I wrote about earlier should put out the same as the Honda Helix unit (about 15 amps) at around $42 msrp according to the CfMoto website. The problem is no one seems to have them. I have been talking with Danny's Scooter Shop in Avon, MA (30 miles away) who happens to be a CfMoto dealer and he cannot find any regulators for the 250cc scoots. One positive note is that he is more than happy to work on any Chinese scoots. I might look him up for my next scoot.

[damin69]

Well The regulator from OregonMotorcycle shipped yesterday. I am hoping to have it tomorrow. If I get it I will try and install it on Sunday. Sofar it looks like I will have some good weather this next week so I should be able to give it a work out. I am not 100 percent sure what the Amp Rating is but on the site the lower end model of this said at least twice as much as the stock and that was comared to a 15 amp Japan RR. Tony did say that this was the biggest regulator he has. So I am hoping for very little voltage loss under a full load. I will let you know how it all goes. When I receive it and work on the install I will start a Thread just on that Regulator to document the progress and results I get. Oh and I got my Volt meters yesterday so I can monitor my voltage now to as I am riding. I will install that when I install the RR.
Have a good day eveyone. I am off to Jury Duty..... Yah.... NOT.

[Cruiser]

Good luck with the experimental regulator, Todd. I found another one that should work also.

www.regulatorrectifier.com/catalog/Universal-Three-Phase-Regulator-Rectifier

40 amp output should be enough to vaporize all the scoot's wiring. ;D

[damin69]

Yup that is a biggie Regulator that is for sure.

The one at OregonMotorcycleparts he is putting plugs on to match the stock OEM plugs from our Jonways. If this all works he can make them up and send them out to anyone that needs them and should be a direct Plug in to the wire harness. He has the schematic now for the Jonway and pictures of the plugs he was a bit suprised. He said that that is the same plugs unchanged of what the Vintage Hondas USE, So he figures it will probably work and out last the scooter.

[Smorkle]

I finally got my new stator and installed it this morning. Now I'm getting 30VAC at idle. The people at partsforchinesescooters.com exchanged the wrong stator with a 20% restocking fee on the old one. All in all it is still cheaper that Roketa.com would have been.

I noticed that my regulator was very hot after only a few minutes of run time too. I had never noticed this before. I'm very interested in this new magic regulator cause I'm betting the one I bought wont last long.

In any event, I'm all up and running again, thanks in part to the helpful people in this forum. I don't know what I'd do without you guys.

[damin69]

Jul 10, 2010 10:31:26 GMT -6 Smorkle said:

I finally got my new stator and installed it this morning. Now I'm getting 30VAC at idle. The people at partsforchinesescooters.com exchanged the wrong stator with a 20% restocking fee on the old one. All in all it is still cheaper that Roketa.com would have been.

I noticed that my regulator was very hot after only a few minutes of run time too. I had never noticed this before. I'm very interested in this new magic regulator cause I'm betting the one I bought wont last long.

In any event, I'm all up and running again, thanks in part to the helpful people in this forum. I don't know what I'd do without you guys.

WOW I'm still suprised that your AC voltage is so low. At idle mine is at 60VAC.

I just got home from a day out scootcaching with my dad. Kept my rpms below 4500 all day and was able to go all day without having to jump my scoot to start it. I left all my extra fans off. Temps out side 85 degrees all day 10 to 20 min jawnt between caches then scoot wound sit and cool off for like 10 to 15 min. Reg did not show today so looks like I have to mow lawn tomorrow instead of work on scoot :-(

[Cruiser]

Have to agree with you, Todd. 60 volts AC is the usual output for a good stator.

I just finished installing the Silicone intakes fan. I used the new fan by shaving about 1/8 inch from the end of the blades. The reason I went through this trouble is because I measured a difference of .2 amps between using this fan blade and the the straight blade OEM one. The new fan pulls 3.2 to 3.3 amps while my OEM used about 5.2 amps. They both seem to move the same amount of air so even if the new one runs like the old one, you should still have a good power savings. Just finished the relay install which controls the charging circuit and my electric fuel pump. This also allows me to get rid of the blocking diode. I also bought a new 12 ah, 230 cca battery to replace the OEM battery. A quick check of the R/R before doing all this showed an output of 14 to 15 volts. Hope to start up the scoot and make some measurements tomorrow.

[damin69]

My voltage is still dropping but the battery stays some what stable at under 40 mph. My voltage drops enough that one of my HIDs actually goes out also. So basically the scooter is only keeping the battery from going dead by shutting down items. I would just LOVE to have STABLE voltage on the out put instead of the MAJOR Drop when the main cooling fan kicks in. So taking it easy that fan does not kick in and with the fan off the system charges. With fan on all the time running 55 mph the voltage drops to the point that it drains the battery. I am hope full that a regulator that can handle the higher current will actually stabilize the voltage so that the system will actually charge properly.

[yoster]

It's these voodoo regulators, I'm tellin' ya. Some dude must have died in the plant while working on them and now exists to haunt us all that uses them.

[Smorkle]

I went out for an hour's ride today. I was pleased with what I have done. The fan kicked on a few times and REALLY blew hard. I could feel it running for the first time in a long time. My volt meter read a constant 13½ volts. Drops back to 12 when you shut the engine off.
It's not jumping about with revving the engine. It stayed at a consistent 13½VDC the entire time.

Should it go up when I rev the engine to 16ish? I can certainly tell the difference with the fan running that it's not going just off the battery. Perhaps I should run wires from my gauge to the wires coming right off the rectifier to get a more accurate reading?

[Smorkle]

it was 13½ volts fan on or fan off. 2000 RPM or 5000 RPM. The fan was running better, I could tell that for sure, but worried about the constant voltage.

Also felt of the regulator after the long ride and it was very hot.

I'm just concerned that I'm not getting what I ought to.