Overall Chinese scooter quality - - - Discuss By kevinharrell (Read 3,729 times)

[richardv]

For the same reason many bought the VW Bug that needed constant attention instead of an American made car with hydraulic lifters, self adjusting brakes, oil filter, efficient water cooling and just as good fuel economy.

Because some found them fun and even enjoyed the constant attention they needed. The rest didn't know how to asses the true cost of ownership of a simply machine. But, they still got exactly what they payed for.

It's the same with these Chinese scooters. Don't go in blind. It is the reason I'm here and after the time I've spent here and other research that I wouldn't waste money on a Chinese scooter over 150cc. I'd save my money for a SYM Citycom 300, lay back and enjoy. And play with that little Chinese toy.

I wonder why no American firm has started making scooters. After all Elio is making a 3 wheeler for a decent price.

[cyborg]

The costs of manufacturing, taxes, labor, workmans comp,,,,

[tdi]

I think nobody that buys one 1000 usd chinese scooter expects the same quality of a 3000 usd jap/euro scooter.
But I think the days when chinese scooters were the punchline are over.
Fabrication methods, feed back, internet foruns and the free market made the product evolve.

On a personal note my gy6 is just 200 kms shy of the 15.000 kms mark in less than 8 months. Not bad right? So far it costed me 1 fuse, 1 spark plug, 1 cable welded and 3 tires. Not bad right?

[cyborg]

Not bad!!! Its great!!! Not too bad at all!!! There's quite a few Chinese scoots out there in service with serious mileage,,,

[rapidjim]

I was wondering when I would see the Chinese scooter bashing again.

Lets put some things in perspective here.

I am old enough to remember when the Japanese bikes were called crap, junk, lemons, not worth the powder to blow them up ect. Now they make a nice machine. They learned, they modified, rebuilt, redesigned and they used better materials. Along with this the price went up and up and up.

The Chinese are going thru the same growing stages. When they first hit the market, they were half assed designed clones with inferior parts. The hoses and belts were lucky to make it off the showroom floor or out of the delivery truck. Now they use gates hoses and belts and their workmanship and designs have greatly improved. Now if they just would get away from cheap plastic fuse holders and glass fuses LOL.

Now we come to the financial side, there are many people that just flat can not afford to buy an expensive machine so they buy a Chinese one that fits their budget. They don't even have to leave their house to do so. This is where a lot of issues come to play and complaints about Chinese machines. You can not buy any Scooter in a crate from the "big 4" and have it delivered to your house. You have to go to a dealership to buy one. Now what some don't realize is that even those machines have to be assembled, PDIed and inspected before they can be sold. When they receive their crated Chinese scoot, some do not realize what all needs to be done before this machine is ready for the road, some get in a hurry and miss things and when the machine breaks they bad mouth the machine. Just human nature. This is why some companies like Ice Bear, require that the machine is PDIed and Assembled by a qualified individual or you loose half of the manufactures warranty.

Another thing, not all Chinese scooters are created equal. Just like anything else. Nor are all "Distributors" or "Dealers". There are good ones and there are those that you need to stay away from. There are those that lower the manufactures warranty period and those that charge the customer extra, some don't even talk to the customer after the sale. There are those that have never seen their product in person or have ever worked on one, they just sit in their bedrooms or cubical, take your order, drop ship you a machine then they forget all about you, as well as those that bend over backwards and provide great after the sale service and warranty.

I have worked on just about every brand of motorcycle, scooter and ATV out there. I will tell you that everyone of them has some kind of issue and not every problem is covered by a recall or warranty. I can also tell you that there are Chinese manufactured parts on Japanese machines, just like there are Japanese parts on some Chinese machines. No matter what you have, if you mistreat it it will break.

I have said it before and I will say it again, if you set up a Chinese machine properly from day one, service it and maintain it, it will give you many miles of enjoyment. I am not saying that issues will not occur, they will, just like any other machine on the road, be it a car, truck, motorcycle, scooter or what ever has wheels and a motor. If there wasn't issues there would be no need for mechanics and shops!

[cyborg]

Bingo Jim wins the prize,,, I've had some pretty weird stuff go wrong on all my machines no matter where the come from

[drahken]

also chinese makes the eletronics in your cars. speak of how wonderful those are too there. but the only time you guys talk about the chinese products is whne you can call it a japanese thing.

the same thing you guys say all the time is the same thing youve always said since the chinese scooters came out, and still, even now. so they havent changed and neither have you. this topics called discuss.. not run over everybody else. and make up any lines you can to bolster you idea of a chinese scooter. you guys have no real by yourselves much to say but you pat each other on your backs. chinese scooters are crap. the reason japanese got better is they leanred. and also what are you guys saying? the honda cub, maade in the 60 and 70s by japan, is a bad bike? i just dont believe that. theyre rock solid from what i heard. the chinese dont learn because of slave labor. you think yoru going to pay someone pennies a day and have them pump you out quality? its not going to happen.

the chinese havent learned and your guys responses to these types of posts havent changed neither. it was the same 5 years ago. and its the same now. you dont learn and they dont learn.

chinese quality is crap. find me a good made bike without a problem that was there before.

when you guys stop responding to posts people have about fuel delivery or some carburetor problem with, buy a new carb, then maybe you can talk about chinese quality.

becuase the answer to a carburetor problem, isnt replaace it. thats a chinese part quality problem. and needs stopped being used.

[Deleted]

Dec 19, 2014 18:41:29 GMT -6 drahken said:

also chinese makes the eletronics in your cars. speak of how wonderful those are too there. but the only time you guys talk about the chinese products is whne you can call it a japanese thing.

the same thing you guys say all the time is the same thing youve always said since the chinese scooters came out, and still, even now. so they havent changed and neither have you. this topics called discuss.. not run over everybody else. and make up any lines you can to bolster you idea of a chinese scooter. you guys have no real by yourselves much to say but you pat each other on your backs. chinese scooters are crap. the reason japanese got better is they leanred. and also what are you guys saying? the honda cub, maade in the 60 and 70s by japan, is a bad bike? i just dont believe that. theyre rock solid from what i heard. the chinese dont learn because of slave labor. you think yoru going to pay someone pennies a day and have them pump you out quality? its not going to happen.

the chinese havent learned and your guys responses to these types of posts havent changed neither. it was the same 5 years ago. and its the same now. you dont learn and they dont learn.

chinese quality is crap. find me a good made bike without a problem that was there before.

when you guys stop responding to posts people have about fuel delivery or some carburetor problem with, buy a new carb, then maybe you can talk about chinese quality.

becuase the answer to a carburetor problem, isnt replaace it. thats a chinese part quality problem. and needs stopped being used.

Theres a lot of things that are better than they used to be. I have a jonway from 08 and my lingyu from 2011. the quality difference is noticeable. the jonway has thin plastic and the screws are easily stripped. the lingyu has thicker plastics and the screws wont strip like on the jonway. the Big chief I have from 02 is a POS quality wise. you should see the wiring. there isn't plastic on it that isn't cracked and the aluminum is more like pot metal. believe me, they got better over the years. want an example of how $h!t the early Chinese things are? look up engine model 1E41QMB. you can also look up scooters like the Sundiro Mantis. those are complete garbage. underpowered chain drive 2 cycle with the oil pump driven OFF THE REAR GEARBOX. what that means is unless your moving, your oil injection isn't working.
lots of the early stuff from harbor freight wasn't good, look at the stuff they sold 10 years ago and its worse than today.


everythings made in china now. yamaha's engines for their smaller things are made in Taiwan. i have a honda GX160 that was made in taiwan.

all our computers are made in china now. apple, dell, hp. you said yourself that automotive electronics are chinese made. they work fine.

some chinese things are crap. if you buy cheap thats what your gonna get. my lingyu was $850. ive not had any trouble with it at all.

if you dont know how to work on them then dont buy one.

[drahken]

if it takes you over a decade to figure it out and you still havent got it figured out then forget it. and im talking about 2008 not 2002. and i have an old sundiro 90cc motor. looks fine to me. actually. i had a 2008 and your telling me they fixed the plastics. the 2008 burnt out the headlight casing, it would almost melt it. belt broke and it wasnt replaceable, the oem one was made different. to fit it. these things still arent fixed and who wants that problem? i know the headlight casings are still plastic will still probably melt. not much of a headlight bulb. hard to ride back when it gets dark.

sure if you buy one to ride towork with, i mean, sure yea itll take you there, but when are you NOt going to ride it on your day off. or like every minute of time off? then its gone in no time. and you didnt much have the money for one to start with. theres used bikes. and id stick away from chinese. until they have a warranty or quality control. some electronics are made in china. not every one of them. just anything though they can get them to mass produce its like making a japan that made mass production first then had problems. sort of, the same concept. take someone who knows nothing and pop in a manufacturing place, so the bad goes to .. EVERywhere

[rapidjim]

Dec 19, 2014 18:41:29 GMT -6 drahken said:

also chinese makes the eletronics in your cars. speak of how wonderful those are too there. but the only time you guys talk about the chinese products is whne you can call it a japanese thing.

the same thing you guys say all the time is the same thing youve always said since the chinese scooters came out, and still, even now. so they havent changed and neither have you. this topics called discuss.. not run over everybody else. and make up any lines you can to bolster you idea of a chinese scooter. you guys have no real by yourselves much to say but you pat each other on your backs. chinese scooters are crap. the reason japanese got better is they leanred. and also what are you guys saying? the honda cub, maade in the 60 and 70s by japan, is a bad bike? i just dont believe that. theyre rock solid from what i heard. the chinese dont learn because of slave labor. you think yoru going to pay someone pennies a day and have them pump you out quality? its not going to happen.

the chinese havent learned and your guys responses to these types of posts havent changed neither. it was the same 5 years ago. and its the same now. you dont learn and they dont learn.

chinese quality is crap. find me a good made bike without a problem that was there before.

when you guys stop responding to posts people have about fuel delivery or some carburetor problem with, buy a new carb, then maybe you can talk about chinese quality.

becuase the answer to a carburetor problem, isnt replaace it. thats a chinese part quality problem. and needs stopped being used.

Okay lets really discuss this with educated facts and experience not with what you have read or heard.

First off let me say again that all Chinese Machines are not created equal. This is also true of anything no matter where it is manufactured. Case in point. Dong Fang reverse trikes have more issues than you can shake a stick at, not only in the product itself but the lack of parts and standing behind their warranty is non existent. You don't have to take my word for it, I can back it up. Pacific Rim International West Inc (Ice Bear), use to sell them for another distributor and they dropped them because of quality and the fact they (as a distributor) could not even get parts or warranty support, so what chance did the consumer have?

On the other hand, Ice Bear is constantly bringing out new machines and Updating/modifying their current line. If they have a confirmed issue with a certain machine they fix the problem in the next model. An example of this is the Magnum which was introduced in 2010. This machine has gone through over a hundred mods, some of which were: differential changes, removing the cable operated reverse system and replacing it with a reverse transmission incorporated into the motor with a side shifter with neutral, redesign of the swing arm, redesign of the rear deck to stop cracking, addition of "cushions" to help with a vibration issue, addition of a steering stabilizer to reduce "tank slap", changing of the headlight bulbs to reduce draw off the stator and provide better light, addition of led light system in the rear to help with visibility, the list goes on. There is a lot more that is documented in this forum as well as 2 other forums.

To date, I have never had an issue with getting any warranty approved and the parts shipped out ASAP. They also take care of any shipping damage, as long as it is annotated on the bill of lading, including the paperwork and replacement parts shipped out at their expense. MSOs for titles are shipped out automatically.

The above example is case and point that not all Chinese machines are junk or that all distributors/manufactures don't care after they get your money. I am sure that there are other dealers that can chime in here and speak to the product they sell. Now Retail Dealers are a different story, there are good ones as well as those that don't give a crap. The forums are full of information on both the good and the bad.

I have sold hundreds of Chinese machines, most of which are still on the road with thousands of miles without major issues. Of course there were those that had early manufacturing issues, but the majority of issues were consumer created. I feel the key to this was initial PDI, Assembly, and regular maintenance.

My Information.

Started working on cars and bikes with my Dad around 1963. Thru my teens working with buddies on cars and bikes. During my service years, I always had a part time job as a mechanic or working out of my own garage. After retirement from the service in 1991 I managed the shop I am in now and bought out the owner in 1993 and still here. I am a Master Automotive Technician (1976) and ASE certified and still taking classes and learning.

We did things a bit backwards from some, we started as a repair shop then became a State Licensed Motorcycle/ Scooter Dealer and repair facility. So when we were ready to be a Dealer we knew what we were getting into and where to find parts, machines and how to deal with people.

A partial list of what we have repaired, ATVs, Scooters, Road Bikes, Dirts Bike, Real Mopeds, mini bikes: Harley, Honda, Yamaha, Kaw, Norton, BSA, Triumph, Victory, Tank, Roketa, Jonway, Sym, Ice Bear, CF Moto, Linhai, Vespa, Baron, Tao Tao, the list goes on.

Dealership ( past and present ) Tank, Jonway, DIAX ( Ice Bear) Roketa.

I think the above more than qualifies me to comment on the quality and life expectancy of Chinese Scooters.

[cyborg]

BAM!!!!

[richardv]

It seems someone should just avoid anything made in China. Best wishes with that.

[drahken]

stop importing crap are you threatening me? i want to report the post above as threatening me.

thats a threatengin statement you crap bag. what is it even poersonal to me about?

whatever this is how the conversation goes on chinese crap they gotta call it the best shti ever or they dont want to even be part of the conversation so why dont you assholes just leave it to people with some experience.

as for experience i see this crap topic happen all the time and everytime its the same thing from the PEOPLE WHO SELL THE THINGS. greatest ever screw the japense.

how about that for something i heard, i heard japan was bad, it just was said and i said how about a honda cub? 60 and 70 model bike. how about that? HOW ABOUT IT?! its ive heard is bulletproof, from lots of people.

so so much for what japan might of messed up on. at least they got some quality coontrol so before you asshole china blow people come on and talk crap to everyone and threaten me you asshole, why dont you, stop telling everyone with fuel delivery problems or some carb problem to, replace the carb. the carb isnt a repalcement item. lets for example take a 1960 chevy. if the carb has a problem flooding.. do you, a. replace or b. rebuild. YOU REBUILD. so screw your responses to everything. including this topic.
and b. STOP TRYING TO LOWER EVERYONE ELSES QUALITY WITH YOUR crap FILLED MOUTHS. i dont want to hear it. nobody cares about it and Noone has to hear it. stay far away fromthis topic since you cant seem to let everyone else discuss this is a topic and it is a forum. so screwoff. BAM hows that for you 2. back to back pat each others asses.

chinese quality is crap and they will resort to any means to push it as any kind of any quality.

i dont care. warranty it, so, that company, are they hgher priced? what money they make they can probably afford to do it. once they have to VOUCH for their own stuff, by putting their own asses on the line it will up in quality. but as long as people like the last 2 posters, who cant keep their stories straight, keep their mouths open, nothing good wille ver come out and the next death by chinese scooter should call for your head.

hows that for everyone chinese quality?

this is just been a kept on personal attack.  so leave  ME ALONE

[drahken]

you also cant talk. none of it makes sense. it seems some people should just avoid anything made from china. best wishes on that.

cause one person isnt going to be able to avoid when everyone is dealing with it here, in THIS FORUM TOPIC. so its a discussion which means more than one person no reason to GET PERSONAL with ME. and the other point is that its things that are made from china. coming from. im not going to china to get these things there being brought here, and PROBABLYy id bet by you, from you. thast where they come from. then you wish best best'es on that? should probably be good luck with that, that would be to everyone and them trying to avoid items coming from china. You can't Made things in china. you made from the area. they are made and done there from there, to here, not there. over to america. made from china. there made, in china, from china here. thats what they are now. if you go to china, are you made in usa? your in china so your not in usa. your not made in usa. your made and from usa. or probably china hahah ohh. good joke. ok thats enough for telling you guys how to speak, using definitions. 

[Deleted]

Dec 20, 2014 17:46:32 GMT -6 drahken said:

stop importing crap are you threatening me? i want to report the post above as threatening me.

thats a threatengin statement you crap bag. what is it even poersonal to me about?

whatever this is how the conversation goes on chinese crap they gotta call it the best shti ever or they dont want to even be part of the conversation so why dont you assholes just leave it to people with some experience.

as for experience i see this crap topic happen all the time and everytime its the same thing from the PEOPLE WHO SELL THE THINGS. greatest ever screw the japense.

how about that for something i heard, i heard japan was bad, it just was said and i said how about a honda cub? 60 and 70 model bike. how about that? HOW ABOUT IT?! its ive heard is bulletproof, from lots of people.

so so much for what japan might of messed up on. at least they got some quality coontrol so before you asshole china blow people come on and talk crap to everyone and threaten me you asshole, why dont you, stop telling everyone with fuel delivery problems or some carb problem to, replace the carb. the carb isnt a repalcement item. lets for example take a 1960 chevy. if the carb has a problem flooding.. do you, a. replace or b. rebuild. YOU REBUILD. so screw your responses to everything. including this topic.
and b. STOP TRYING TO LOWER EVERYONE ELSES QUALITY WITH YOUR crap FILLED MOUTHS. i dont want to hear it. nobody cares about it and Noone has to hear it. stay far away fromthis topic since you cant seem to let everyone else discuss this is a topic and it is a forum. so screwoff. BAM hows that for you 2. back to back pat each others asses.

chinese quality is crap and they will resort to any means to push it as any kind of any quality.

i dont care. warranty it, so, that company, are they hgher priced? what money they make they can probably afford to do it. once they have to VOUCH for their own stuff, by putting their own asses on the line it will up in quality. but as long as people like the last 2 posters, who cant keep their stories straight, keep their mouths open, nothing good wille ver come out and the next death by chinese scooter should call for your head.

hows that for everyone chinese quality?

lets have a look at the bold statement there. the original carbs are SEALED units. you can drill out the screws so you can take it apart and go to all the trouble of unsealing it, or you can replace it for $25-30 bucks and have a completely unsealed unit that is adjustable and rebuildable. the problem being that to rebuild one of these carbs takes about the same amount of money in parts as a new carb. why not buy a new carb then? as for the 1960 chevy carb, its a little different, the parts to rebuild will cost considerably less than the carb. its like comparing apples to oranges. your argument is weak because of that.

there are Chinese things that are garbage. look at sites like amazon. lots of good stuff but also lots of stuff not worth the stuff to blow it to hell. I don't really have to say any more. this is a primarily Chinese scooter forum and if you don't like then you can LEAVE and go to a place like modernvespa or whatever.

Luke aint been around so this is what we get? I want Luke back at least he was funny!