Scooter Doc
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Post by bobf on Feb 28, 2016 16:02:08 GMT -6
OK Alleyoop, you win again. I went back to the scoot thinking not more air leaking as I had gone over that all recently. But again you were right. It was my air housing from the rear around to the front of the carb. I had put it in very carefully and had use my rubber mallet to ensure it was well seated on the carb. I had the bands tight on the carb and the air intake box. I had put a large washer on the screw holding down the molded air housing. But apparently I did not tighten that screw down very well. The air housing was found to be half off the front of the carb.
It is now back on, all clamps and screws are very tight. I have run it a couple times and let it cool between and it seems to be working well now and the first idle is a bit fast, up to around 2500 for a minute or less, and then it starts slowing down to about 1800 rpm. Getting to think I am near the end of messing with the starting and running things.
Now I also have found where my coolant is coming from. It is dripping from the weep hole under the pump area. So I will order those two seals and new gasket tonight. So maybe next weekend I will have it all back together and running well again.
Then the covers go back on. Then I get to ride again. Then if the wife wins the discussion I will have a for sale sign for it. Been a confusing but learning few months for me.
You help has been good too. So thanks a bunch for all the help.
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Scooter Doc
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Post by bobf on Feb 27, 2016 19:35:27 GMT -6
I have put much back on the scoot and have tried to get the valves properly adjusted. Been running reasonably well recently but I do have some questions about the start routine.
First I will comment on the cold start.
From a cold start the engine fires right away and the RPM's go straight up to as high as 4,000 rpm. This will last for a short bit and then start to slow down and then it sometimes goes all the way down to near 1,000 rpm. Sometimes it stalls and I have to restart. Then as it warms up it slowly rises up to between 1,500 or 2,000 rpm where it will hang around and just keep running.
What seems to be wrong with that way of starting and warming up? Is there something wrong with the fuel system, air or fuel control mechanism, that I need to adjust or replace?
OK, now I will comment on the valves and adjustments.
I have taken the time to mark the top of the adjusters with black Sharpie marker. Then as listening I take one valve at a time and tweak this way or that and listen for tapping and steady firing. When done I clean and then remark the valve lifter thing. Always want to have a marker to get back to what I thought was a good point if things get worse.
Now, which valve would likely cause the backfire that happens on occasion. I have things pretty good but still getting numbers of backfires during idle time. If I know which valve is likely the one causing the backfires I could spend some time going to that valve and fine tweaking till it is quieter.
I won't be putting on the plastics till I am really convinced it is running correctly. As I hate taking it off in the first place.
Finally feeling like I am making headway toward a rideable machine.
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Post by bobf on Feb 20, 2016 13:39:22 GMT -6
That fuel pump thing is OK with me, I am never buying from them anymore anyway.
I was not trying to put you down at all as I see that confusion often in the various forums. So I offered proof of which machine is what. Nothing more and nothing less. I have no idea why some also put the B after the scooter name as it has nothing to do with the engine for sure.
Your help has been appreciated. Will let you know after I get my new fuel pump as to how well it will be working.
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Post by bobf on Feb 20, 2016 6:48:40 GMT -6
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Post by bobf on Feb 19, 2016 19:19:51 GMT -6
This might even be the Rocketa part I was referring too.
My scoot is MC 54 250B. The one you posted is for the MC 54B 250. The 54B signifies the horizontal engine machine and the 250B is more of a variation of some sort. It is on my paperwork and in their catalog stuff.
I won't go into my scooter parts list to check as it does not matter. I won't go near Rocketa to buy anything any more.
Thanks for your inputs.
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Post by bobf on Feb 19, 2016 17:16:33 GMT -6
Thanks for this info. If my new fuel pump is another failure, I will give this consideration.
If I look at Rocketa I find my fuel pump at something around $120 but on sale for about $65. That makes your suggestion seem real low cost.
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Post by bobf on Feb 19, 2016 14:04:59 GMT -6
It is on my floor ahead of the feet. I need a fuel pump and have already ordered one for $19.99. It should be here by next Friday.
Was working on the scoot a bit ago and it would not start. Running it would not bring gas out of the tube from the tank. It is just too slow as I pointed out a couple times even with a new battery. So I put on my primer cup and started that way. Now it was able to flow gas out the tube from the pump. So I switched to the pump to carb setup and it started and ran well. It ran till the radiator got hot and the fan came on. But it also started running slower and rougher. When it stopped I pulled the Vac line from the ACV and it had gas in it. So I pulled the vac line from the fuel pump and a lot of gas poured out of it.
Good thing that I already had order another pump. I ran a bit without the vac line attached and it ran well but no gas was coming from the vac line hookup on the fuel pump. So it must be the vacuum that somehow pulls the gas out and up to the carb.
Will find out next week end if a new pump fixes the problem.
The new pump I already had did not fix a thing which may be why I have been posting for so many months and getting no answers. Bad pump seems to be the problem and if another pump does not fix the problem that will be three in a row or I am chasing the wrong thing. No gas should be coming from the vacuum port on the pump.
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Post by bobf on Feb 19, 2016 10:33:04 GMT -6
Thanks for the info and I think I will follow your suggestion and just order one of those smaller $16 dollar ones. Less loss if they don't work either.
The one you posted for me is the same as the one I bought and it does not work at all. So I will try to prime it to see if that is the problem and if not, then it goes to trash also.
Still being rushed for time as I now have to get some plantings ready for spring. I did not think owning a scoot would become a life long 'fix it' situation. Since coming out of the crate is has been take off the covers and fix this or that. My first fix was a problem with the gas tank as it did not hold the gas as the gauge port was leaking. Wonderful first experience with your new scooter.
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Post by bobf on Feb 18, 2016 14:24:08 GMT -6
Hello Alleyoop. I am again looking to buy another fuel pump. My original one won't work so I bought another one at about $40. And it appears to be the one to pump gas out of the vacuum line.
I have been looking on the forums for another one but would rather pay in the $20 or less range. Most do not show dimensions or bolt hole locations. Most seem to be at about 3.00 inches but my scoot requires 3.375 inches.
Do you know of any dealers that sell in reasonable prices with mounting hole dimensions of their products on display?
Been shopping and now ready to go to he doctors.
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Post by bobf on Feb 17, 2016 16:04:42 GMT -6
I can do as you suggest but that would not explain why I had gas in my vac line and that was my concern.
No more scoot till later this week as I said above.
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Post by bobf on Feb 17, 2016 15:17:17 GMT -6
I am not doing too well today Alleyoop. When the engine was running it was slow and made lots of black smoke. I found the fuel pump was allowing, or I caused, fuel to be in the vac line. It looked clear and had no obvious odor so I took a small sample in a pie pan out to the driveway and lit my lighter. Big blaze for a moment. When the engine did run it put out black smoke and made backfiring noises and would not idle. I played with the valve settings but nothing changed until it would not run at all. That is when I was chasing the vac lines again and found liquid in them again.
So I took that fuel pump out and put the one I swapped out a couple days back in its place. So far the engine try's to start but has not yet. If this one fails I will put the other one in for a quick test and if it fails again, I will need to buy another fuel pump.
And for the vac lines I had it just like you wanted for a couple days now, including reversing the one you called a 'Y'. It seems like you have not read my words or I am not speaking properly. I will not be working on the vac tubes any more until I get this fuel pump thing straightened outs. If I need another fuel pump I will try to find a different vendor as this 'New pump' may also be bad. That is why I will run this one today, if it will, and then try the other one also. To make sure if it is good or bad or my mistake in setting it up.
I sure would not think it would work at all if I had not put the 'fuel in' and 'fuel out' and 'vac' tubes in the right places.
Tomorrow the wife wants to spend shopping and I have a doctor in the afternoon. So not much progress till Friday or Saturday.
Back to the scoot shortly.
Have a good day.
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Post by bobf on Feb 17, 2016 6:54:30 GMT -6
From your last post you are saying i must have the air tube installed or nothing. It ran a couple days ago and ran fine without the air tube. So today, when I get to time, I will install the air tube and try again to get it to start and run.
Still wondering where all that yellow liquid came from and how did it get to fill all those vacuum tubes. Some in the tube to the Carb, some in the tube to the fuel pump, some in the tube to to the charcoal canister, but still no source found. Amazing situation. A few days back I changed the fuel pump and no yellow liquid then.
Will put the air tube on and report events after that.
No comments on the battery being good for just a couple turns of the starter before needing recharge. Seems like a complete drain in seconds and no reserve for a second start without more charging done.
Will need to pay bills and do other domestic things first. Then back to the scoot.
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Post by bobf on Feb 16, 2016 19:40:09 GMT -6
Alleyoop. When it ran good the vent tubing went to the fuel pump and the rubber carb mount and the ACV was left unconnected. When I tried to connect to the ACV, or put my finger over the end of the tub, was when the engine would quit.
Today the vent from the tank is hanging, no longer connected to anything or the charcoal canister. The other vent hose has also been disconnected from the charcoal canister and is free from the connections to the other vent tubes. It is just hanging around with nothing to do. It is currently just the way you sent it to me to be done.
Each time I try to start the engine with the ACV disconnected it will run for a few seconds at most then die. Then I can not get it to restart and have to wait till the battery is charged again. I just went through that a few minutes back. Not sure if it will start with the ACV is connected. Will try that tomorrow.
Somehow wonder about the electrical system as this is a new battery but only gets a few turns on the starter to kill off the battery. That is why I went and changed in my older battery for this newer one.
I spoke wrong in one of my earlier posts as I said I need to go to the doctor tomorrow. My wife proved me wrong and showed I was reading the calendar wrong. So tomorrow I will have some time to try the starting again.
Have a good night.
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Post by bobf on Feb 16, 2016 16:24:14 GMT -6
Alleyoop, in the post just ahead of yours I said I had just put the gas in there and it was not very old either. I bought it on Jan 24 2016 so not old. Today I bought some more for the scoot.
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Post by bobf on Feb 16, 2016 15:16:55 GMT -6
Thanks for responding. I was just out checking the vent line and found the one to the gas tank to also be filled with that yellow, no odor, type of fluid. It is all drained now from all three lines. When the battery is once again charged I will try to start. Doesn't matter if gas or coolant, just don't know how that stuff is getting in there.
I just have put some gas in the tank so it is now half full. I don't see how that could be the problem as for right now the hose is just hanging down and open.
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