WARNING!!! ICE BEAR DRIVETRAIN PROBLEMS!!! By wildman (Read 19,499 times)

[wildman]

A Doc's
The Reason Your ICE BEAR TRIKE JUMPS OR SHUTTERS is because of faulty case or from stress & strain dew to torque & weight.. More info toward the bottom of the page of this link..
scootdawg.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=threewheelers&action=display&thread=29108&page=17


What a depressing day.. Just got Bear reassembled, so the parts don't get lost... Everything in the transmission gear box & it's components are in good shape, all of that jumping I was getting last fall & part of the winter went away, then came back about 3 times over this last couple of weeks.. I believe there's 2 possibilities, 1) The left side engine case had a flaw in the casting of the final drive where the bearing was held in place, allowing the bearing & shaft to move, which allowed the teeth to jump, breaking out the casting, or 2) The final drive shaft was flexing dew to all the torque & weight (400 lb + 260 lb = 660 lb) & causing the gears to jump teeth & busting up the case.. I'll bet that's wolfhound's & his body's problem too!!

Here the kicker thought, remember over the winter the email I said I got from Ice Bear that they basically said there was a known problem in the drive train, but nobody would say exactly what that problem was?? Well listen to this, I call Scooters Dynasty, & they said the 150cc trikes are no longer available w/ a reverse gear box because of all the problems.. NOW IS THAT SOME crap OR WHAT??

David Sr.

[rapidjim]

It is true that IB has had numerous problems with the 09 150s and reverse gear. It is also true that the new 2010 models do not have reverse.

Now why IB decided to remove reverse instead of fixing the problem is beyond me. At least they admit there is a problem, unlike some others I could mention. All my Rep was told was that the bike is light enough not to need reverse, now that doesn't help folks with a handicap that would need it. They would have to go with a 300 to get reverse.

Now as far as the 300cc is concerned, the reverse is in the rear diff as I showed in the my PDI pictures of the Magnums we did. It has a very long throw on the control, 180 degree swing at the handlebar. It feels very solid and no jumping between reverse and forward.

I have seen nor worked on any 150s so I have to rely on what I have read on the forums and ask questions from IB.

David Sr. I took the liberty of sending your pictures to my rep at IB Ca and asked if the motor case caused the problem if it would be covered under warranty. I will follow up with a phone call this afternoon. Hope you don't mind.

Jim/Owner
Rapid Repair

[wildman]

rapidjim
That would be great!! Though it probably won't get traction, because early this year I replaced the rear sprocket (because I was putting an $80.00 sealed O-ring chain on & didn't want to put a new chain on used sprockets), & discovered a problem in the differential.. So I took the differential apart & found 1 bad bearing all the spider gear shims were all chewed up.. I got Ice Bear to replace the differential under warranty, but at the same time there was a discussion about the transmission gear box problems & they said if they warranty the differential that they wouldn't warranty anything farther to do w/ any gear box issues.. Well, that's another sign they knew there were more up coming drive issues.. I sent the pics to Scooters Dynasty & they forwarded them to Ice Bear, but Vince at Scooter Dynasty fears Ice Bear will reject the claim.. The above issue will be how they get out from under my claim.. I can't hold this against Scooters Dynasty because Vince does his part w/ any of my Scooter issues, a little slow to respond, but that's most likely an Ice Bear issue as well..

David Sr.

[zugzug]

I guess I should read the trike section more often. There were some articles on the web about the trans problem and how to fix it. You had to disassemble it and put in some shims because of the excessive tolerance levels. (too much free play between parts) It won't really help ya now but I will see if I can find the info again.
-Zug

[wildman]

zugzug
Ya, something that would've cost them maybe $5., ends up costing me almost $3,000. & a hell of a lot more in the end...

Probably the best I can hope for now is paying for a new left side engine case, bearings, seals, & gears... I just don't know it's worth all that w/ all the money I've got tied up into it... Probably should just cut my losses now..

I know someone that's been trying to talk me into putting a 3 cylinder diesel into it.. That won't happen, at least not from my pocket..

David Sr.

[Alleyoop]

Wildman,
I would just go with a new engine, just getting half of the engine and your time putting it together is also worth a lot. Here is one for $419.00 shipped with Reverse.
Alleyoop
www.motopartsmax.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=15404&medium=organic&utm_campaign=motoparts_all.1

[rapidjim]

Here is what IB sent me:

Jim,

The problem with the gear box happen when we changed the reverse from the side of the unit to the handle bar. When the unit was put into reverse, the reverse cable did not pull all the way so the unit was not engaging into reverse and after time it started to damage the gear box. We changed the lever to have the two points on it to be farther apart to properly engage the units. I have not had many issues after the reverse lever was changed. Most of the people calling about the gear boxes are customers with the old reverse levers. If it is within the warranty period I do warranty it.

I am not sure which model this customer has. Like I said before the only times I have spoken to customers about this issue has been because of the reverse issue.

Thank you,


Jim/Owner
Rapid Repair

[Alleyoop]

Jim,
Well that sounds promesing for the Wildman. You are TERRIFIC my man. Never have I seen or heard of a Dealer be so helpfull. You go far beyond helping people and the THING THATS STICKS OUT IS "THEY DID NOT BUY FROM YOU". That is "UNHEARD OF IN MY NECK OF THE WOODS". When my PST150H Trike gives it up I will definitely order a 300cc from you and go and pick it up(AFTER A PDI OF COURSE ) . I live in Suburb of Chicago (Westmont-60559). So I think its about a 4 hour Drive to where you are at in WI.

Also if anyone is looking to buy one I will POINT THEM YOUR WAY.
Me and my Brother-in Law always get stopped by people asking the usual, how fast does it go where did you get it, how much etc..

Alleyoop

[rapidjim]

Alley al I can say is that is how I do business and I am always willing to help someone out if I can. Just my upbringing I guess. Thank you sir for your kind words. Let's just hope his machine is still under warranty.

Jim/Owner
Rapid Repair

[damin69]

Jim is this your site www.rapidrepairpowersports.com/

I am very impressed with your beyond the call of service. My dad and I both live in Wisconsin and both run Chinese scooters so always nice to have some place that is in the state if we might need something.

[zugzug]

Jun 9, 2010 12:17:16 GMT -6 wildman said:

zugzug

I know someone that's been trying to talk me into putting a 3 cylinder diesel into it.. That won't happen, at least not from my pocket..

David Sr.

Thats funny that you mention a diesel motor. I actually bought a kz400 to do a diesel/cvt conversion on. The bike ran so good I sold it to a friend because I didnt have the heart to hack it up. Diesel fuel used to be quite a bit cheaper than gas but the between the big oil and taxes diesel is now more expensive than auto fuel. So any gains in fuel mileage is now offset by the higher fuel cost. I was looking at the 10hp motor but you can occasionally find a 20-24hp air cooled v-twin listed on ebay but they run $1500+

[rapidjim]

Damin That is my parts site and my trike site is www.rapidrepair.webs.com

[wolfhound]

Jim, sorry but I have question IB's response to you concerning the problem being only in reverse and only when it involved the handlebar shift lever. My 150-8 is a ruckus clone and
has the side shift. I have had a constantly recurring problem with both foreward and reverse
to the point that you could see the rear bouncing on takeoff. I have discussed this privately with you and I agree with the above comments concerning your going the extra mile. You do
business like I do business. I think the IB warrenty is 60 days.There may be other issues that
cause the problem and if we come up with them we will pass it on. My Summer Project will be
complete on way or another in the next few weeks. I have to wonder how many people have
bought these units online and have had these problems and are never hear from because they dont belong to the forums. It would be interesting to know the answer.
PS: Every time I got the cable adjusted to where I had no problem it would return in a few miles.

[Alleyoop]

Well all I can say, I have TWO trikes to care for mine and my Brother-in Laws. We both have the same Identical Trikes the PST150H. And we have had them now Since June of 2009 and I keep on saying if you know how to Adjust the Reverse Cable you will not have a problem. We both have not had any Jumping or anything with ours, but I am a wrencher and our Reverse Handle is by the Right Side by the Floorboard. Having the Handle by the Floorboard it Pulls on the Cable further than when the Handle is on the Handlebar.

Now I can understand WHY they said the Reverse Handle by the Handlebars may cause a problem it is simple to understand. The Handle being on the Handlebar does NOT give enough Cable Travel to fully pull the Mechanism that moves the Gear inside all the way to securely engage the Reverse Gear inside. So then what happens is You adjust the Cable to Engage the Reverse BUT what then happens is NOW when you release it for Forward It NOW does NOT engage the Forward Gear enough because of the limited cable travel that was taken up to have it engage Reverse.

All that it really needs is a LONGER Arm on the Mechanism so that Just a Little PULL on the CABLE will move it further either way. I would take the Mechanism OFF take it to Welder and Have him Extend the Part that holds the Lead Ball about 1/2 and that would allow a lot more swing on the Mechanism with less cable travel. Doing this the Reverse Handle would not have to move a lot to actually have the cable move the Mechanism Clockwise a lot more.
Alleyoop

[wildman]

wolfhound
The Ice Bear Warranty is 1 year from the date of purchase.. Wolfhound I hope you're following & reading this post.. You need to contact your dealer before your 1 year warranty runs out, & if they're telling you, you only had 90 days, they're feeding you a line of crap, & you better call Ice Bear instead.. I know this because I bought my trike in 9/2009 & I had my differential replaced under warranty 2 - 3 months ago...

Alley
You've got this all wrong my friend, I've been wrenching for over 30 years.. To start w/ you've got the 2 types of shift levers backwards... They went to the lever on the handle bars to correct the problems w/ the forward /reverse gear engagement... But I don't believe that's the problem that everyone is having, that's why nobody can get rid of this jumping /shuttering problem... ZugZug hit it on the nail head, read his statement above in this post.. ZugZug stated that there's an article floating around on the web about the drive train problem w/ these machines & the fix which consists of shims to tighten up final gear mesh... When I pull the forward /reverse gear box apart there was no sings of problems, no damage, all the damage is in the final drive unit, which is between the gear box & the clutch.. In my opinion the problem in the forward /reverse gear box had nothing to do w/ the damage in the final drive unit... Like I said before, I'll bet dollars to donuts that the problem w/ wolfhounds trike is in the final drive unit & not the forward /reverse gear box...



David Sr...